Implications of AI to schools • Hacker News Board

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#421

Post by wffurr » Tue, Nov 25, 2025, 8:46 PM UTC

nmfisher wrote: post #176

wffurr wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday's Doonesbury was on point here: https://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2025/11/23 Andrej and Garry Trudeau are in agreement that "blue book exams" (I.e. the teacher gives you a blank exam booklet, traditionally blue) to fill out in person for the test, after confiscating devices, is the only way to assess students anymore. My 7 year old hasn't figured out how to use any LLMs yet, but I'm sure the day will come…

That was how I took most of my school and university exams. I hated it then and I'd hate it now. For humanities, at least, it felt like a test of who could write the fastest (one which I fared well at, too, so it's not case of sour grapes). I'd be much more in favour of oral examinations. Yes, they're more resource-intensive than grading written booklets, but it's not infeasible. Separately, I also hope it might go s…

We had orals for graded programming assignments in graduate school. You had to present your solution to a panel and defend it. Some of my classmates really struggled with anxiety in front of the panel and took any question, however mild, as intense personal criticism.

Maybe this is a case for "learning styles", but it's probably logistically prohibitive to offer both options.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#422

Post by beeflet » Tue, Nov 25, 2025, 8:55 PM UTC

SoftTalker wrote: post #392

beeflet wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, it isn't hard! Watch: Computer, show "my" work and explain to the teacher why "I" wrote what "I" did, describe why that particular approach to the narrative appealed to "me" and "I" chose that as the basis of "my" work. Produce an outline on which the paper could have been based and possible rough drafts, then explain how I could have revised the work to produce the final result.

And if you do all of that, and memorize it well enough to have an in-person debate with the teacher over whether or not you did the work, then maybe that's close enough to actually doing the work?

Computer, experience this tragic irony for me

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#423

Post by _aavaa_ » Tue, Nov 25, 2025, 9:21 PM UTC

wombatpm wrote: post #390

ghaff wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did have interviews with a government agency many years ago that, among other things, involved a battery of tests including what I assume were foreign civil service exams. I got an offer though I didn't take it. But assuming in-person day long batteries of tests for universities and companies is probably not very practical. You can argue whether university is a very efficient use of time or money but it presumably…

Companies and governments use to do testing all the time. A number of lawsuits about those practices being discriminatory resulted in them going away.

No, they used to do IQ tests which were found discriminatory (and don't correlate with job performance). Tests and problems directly or indirectly related to the job are not only legal, but are commonly used (leetcode).

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#424

Post by Viliam1234 » Tue, Nov 25, 2025, 9:36 PM UTC

snickerbockers wrote: post #326

somenameforme wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't mind seeing education return to its roots of being about learning instead of credentialization. In an age where having a degree is increasingly meaningless in part due to many places simply becoming thinly veiled diploma treadmills (which are somehow nonetheless accredited), this is probably more important than ever. This is doubly so if the AI impact extremists end up being correct. So why is the issue yo…

I still don't understand why standardized testing gets so much pushback. Having the students do their work in a controlled environment is the obvious solution to AI and many other problems related to academic integrity. Its also the only way that students can actually be held to the same standards. When I was a freshman in college with a 3.4 highschool GPA, I was absolutely gobsmacked by how many kids with perfect >=…

> I still don't understand why standardized testing gets so much pushback.

Parents of the children who can't pass the standardized tests also get a vote.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#425

Post by HDThoreaun » Tue, Nov 25, 2025, 9:38 PM UTC

eloisant wrote: post #417

HDThoreaun wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with this strategy is that homework is mostly a tool for learning, not checking progress. Most teachers use homework as a way to get an extra hour or two of learning in each week for the students. If we remove it there will be less learning time available. So you’re gonna have to expand the school day or school year which means more teachers which is expensive.

If homework is not used to check progress, then cheating on it is not a problem. Don't grade homework. Only grade work done in school. Students who cheat on their homework are just deterring themselves and won't do as good at the in-class, graded exams.

Well it comes down to what the point of school is. If the goal is just to figure out how competent a student is, sure, but if the goal is to educate students then reducing the amount of time they spend on school work will lead to worse outcomes.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#426

Post by gonzobonzo » Tue, Nov 25, 2025, 11:17 PM UTC

array_key_first wrote: post #321

gonzobonzo wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an incredible abuse of power to intentionally mark innocent students' answers wrong when they're correct. Just to solve your own problem, that you may very well be responsible for. Knowing the way a lot of professors act, I'm not surprised, but it's always disheartening to see how many behave like petty tyrants who are happy to throw around their power over the young.

If you cheat, you should get a zero. How is this controversial. Since high school, the expectation is that you show your work. I remember my high school calculus teacher didn't even LOOK at the final answer - only the work. The nice thing was that if you made a trivial mistake, like adding 2 + 2 = 5, you got 95% of the credit. It worked out to be massively beneficial for students. The same thing continued in programm…

> If you cheat, you should get a zero. How is this controversial.

Because the teacher was knowingly giving zeroes to students who didn't cheat, and expecting them to take it upon themselves to reverse this injustice.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#427

Post by peebee67 » Wed, Nov 26, 2025, 12:53 AM UTC

germinalphrase wrote: post #143

respondo2134 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

honest q: what would it look like from your perspective if someone worked in entirely different tools and then only moved their finished work to google docs at the end?

In this case, the school was providing chromebooks so Google Docs were the default option. Using a different computer isn’t inherently a negative signal - but if we are already talking about plagiarism concerns, I’m going to start asking questions that are likely to reveal your understanding of the content. If your understanding falters, I’m going to ask you to prove your abilities in a different way/medium/etc. In g…

> In general, I don’t really understand educators hyperventilating about LLM use. If you can’t tell what your students are independently capable of and are merely asking them to spit back content at you, you’re not doing a good job.

Sounds as though you do understand it.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#428

Post by fluorinerocket » Wed, Nov 26, 2025, 1:05 AM UTC

thinkindie wrote: post #115

this is a very American issue. In my entire student career in Italy, home assignments were never graded. Maybe you had a project or two through university, but otherwise I got all my grades for onsite tests.

When I was a kid in Italy in the late 80s early 90s the elentary school teachers also did "interrogazione" at the blackboard. That is individual kids would go up to the blackboard and get asked questions front of the rest of the class.

Not sure if those two were just old school (they'd occasionally hit us/ pull ears too) but damn was I ahead of all the other kids when I came back to the USA

Also the two teachers had the same class of kids for all of elementary school, teaching 1st through 5th grades sequentially So they got to know the kids quite well

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#429

Post by amrocha » Wed, Nov 26, 2025, 3:13 AM UTC

oblio wrote: post #256

amrocha wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re gonna have to talk about your work to people that matter at some point in your life. You can’t keep hiding behind being an introvert your whole life.

1. I'm not introvert :-) 2. Speaking about your work in front of 1-2-5 people is one thing, but being tested in front of an entire class (30 people?) is a totally different thing.

It’s not that different from giving a presentation in front of your team to a stakeholder.

It’s not that different from speaking up in your neighborhood group.

Speaking in front of people and advocating for yourself is a core human skill. If you don’t practice it you’re setting yourself up for failure.

I would even say it has nothing to do with introverts and extroverts.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#430

Post by reinier » Wed, Nov 26, 2025, 7:53 AM UTC

Balgair wrote: post #311

Again, AI is not getting rid of degrees or learning or education. It's getting rid of cheap methods. Scantrons and bluebooks were always a way that made it cheap for institutions to produce results. Now those methods kinda seem silly, right? 500 person freshman lectures seem kinda absurd now, right? Teaching via adjuncts that had 3 days notice for the class and are paid nothing is kinda scammy, right? R1s professors…

to me this sounds like it means cheaper education. smaller classes could also be achieved more easily.

when we've just made personalized education viable for everybody. schools already have the computers, laptops, tablets and study spaces. only thing left is to put these AI education apps on them. classes could also just remain the same size. students will get personalized education through the app. students can still interact with the teacher when necessary or for class wide sessions with the teacher.