421–430 of 714 posts
Since fighting for release of this video and publishing the story, Ken Klippenstein has been censored on Twitter through shadow bans and inability to find his profile through search.
The question that is never answered in this kind of story is: 1. How many fatalities per mile does tesla FSD have, compared to its best alternative if we ban it? 2. Focusing on specific failure cases is not relevant since the political decision to allow it is all or nothing. 3. It'd be perfectly logical to accept road testing FSD, even if it's significantly worse in some areas, as long as this is not exploitable, AND…
Other people have said it before, but the issue is that the Tesla crashes we are seeing are ones that a human would trivially avoid. Most people, especially non technical people, aren’t going to care about numbers that say it’s safer or better on net when the car still occasionally does things that humans view as crazy or stupid.
That a Tesla crashes in ways a human wouldn't doesn't seem true. From what I've seen, even the most common accident type for a Tesla occurs at a lower rate than non-Tesla cars.
Do you have more info that's more specific about the types of crashes?
The problem here is a lot of the worst crashes are caused by humans behaving crazy and stupid. It's not a good criticism.
In other news, no car has ever seized up and stopped at an inconvenient moment before Tesla made this horrible mistake, and keeping a safe distance would not be necessary if it weren’t for those dang automated drivers. Now get off my lawn!
From what I can tell, the car behind the tesla didn't crash into the tesla but stopped before. And so did the car behind that one. It is the cars after that that crashed into each others. While automatic cars doing random things is certainly problematic, clearly the cause of the crash here isn't the tesla, it is other cars not respecting minimum safety distances and not able to stop when there is a traffic jam ahead.
> clearly the cause of the crash here isn't the tesla, it is other cars not respecting minimum safety distances The cause of the crash is the Tesla. You are not allowed to stop on bridges, in tunnels and several other places. The crashes starting with the Nth car and not the 1st is normal. Reaction time of the first car eats into the reaction of the second and so on until there's no more time to stop. Understand that…
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So if an automaker can make a system that is capable of handling any driving task safely but occasionally ran itself off the road on purpose for no reason, as long as it’s a net positive in lives saved it should be allowed? I don’t agree with that assessment. It needs to make fewer mistakes than humans at all times , not just most of the time. Great with a disaster here and there is terrible.
Firstly, human error in at least 7 out of the 8 cars caused this. FSD didn't take control away from the human, it encountered something outside of it's limits and returned full control to the human. Secondly, that's what planes are. A lot of new plane safety comes from very automated, very complicated systems. In some situations these planes fail in a way that leaves the pilot in a more dangerous plane than one with…
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In my opinion 90% of the reason we don’t have more accidents is because people are so predictable. Watch dangerous drivers weave through traffic - it’s only possible because everyone follows spoken and unspoken rules. Randomly stopping is not some “you need to be prepared, it’s your fault” moment.
A car switching into an empty lane and then stopping hard even more. If a human driver did it deliberately as the Tesla did (since it was designed to pull over and stop) then I would consider it a criminal level traffic violation on the part of the stopping car.
From what I can tell, the car behind the tesla didn't crash into the tesla but stopped before. And so did the car behind that one. It is the cars after that that crashed into each others. While automatic cars doing random things is certainly problematic, clearly the cause of the crash here isn't the tesla, it is other cars not respecting minimum safety distances and not able to stop when there is a traffic jam ahead.
> clearly the cause of the crash here isn't the tesla, it is other cars not respecting minimum safety distances The cause of the crash is the Tesla. You are not allowed to stop on bridges, in tunnels and several other places. The crashes starting with the Nth car and not the 1st is normal. Reaction time of the first car eats into the reaction of the second and so on until there's no more time to stop. Understand that…
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This is a case of phantom braking, which is illegal. People often forget about the most important traffic rule: it is not allowed to cause an unsafe situation.
If you crash into the car in front of you in your lane, the responsibility is yours both morally and legally. The only car which has a valid excuse is the car immediately following the tesla since the tesla inserted itself into its lane then immediately stopped, not allowing it to build a safety distance.
It's not that simple. If it was it would be legal to break check someone and it would be that persons fault for crashing in to you.
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Yes, FSD is essentially a complete rewrite of Autopilot which will soon replace it for freeway driving too. Autopilot has been available for many years and FSD is new. This accident could have happened years ago and is not evidence of any issue with the new FSD stuff.
But since there's no behavioural difference, it doesn't matter if it's a complete rewrite or not.
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I was thinking the same. One earlier article about this had a rather inflammatory photo of some twisted-up cars next to an empty baby buggy. But if you watch the video, that’s clearly where some human drivers ploughed straight into the back of the pile-up. The Tesla autopilot failure is really bad, for sure, but those human drivers should be banned for life. There’s no excuse for ramming into a traffic jam because yo…
Good luck maintaining a safe distance on a busy highway when every time you slow to make a space, somebody moves into the space from a different lane.