New video of Tesla crash demonstrates the problem of semi-automated driving

Post by darkwater » Thu, Jan 12, 2023, 8:52 AM UTC

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #120

birken wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair most people who are driving cars aren't towing caravans, so this seems like an extreme edge case. I heavily use adaptive cruise control and I've never had any issues with it, though I'm always ready to take over in case anything complicated starts happening. It's a nice feature because it saves a lot of energy when the driving is very easy, and then you just drive normally otherwise.

> this seems like an extreme edge case Most ships don't sink, but we still have lifeboats. Most jet engines don't fail, but we still train pilots to land without them. Its edgecases that kill.

Post by abigail95 » Thu, Jan 12, 2023, 8:57 AM UTC

m_mueller wrote: post #163

projektfu wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Tesla cut into the lane with 3 car-lengths or less behind it and rapidly decelerated. The two cars behind are going to collide because the first one, who was safely positioned before the Tesla changed lanes, didn't have time to react and the second car was probably not able to either, because the brake lights in front didn't come on until too late. Then, there was a couple cars that were probably tailgating, and…

It’s also just not realistic. If everyone was that defensive (5+ seconds distance) on such a busy road it would severely lower its capacity, leading to constant traffic jams. Leaving that gap will just mean others taking it.

Post by janalsncm » Thu, Jan 12, 2023, 8:59 AM UTC

somethoughts wrote: post #65

I think what's interesting here is it's likely the first instance where Tesla FSD has been involved in an accident which affected other drivers. [Edit] From the video the Tesla is making a lane change and stopping simultaneously which means there could be a case of the Tesla FSD/driver doing a unsafe lane change.[1] Most of the time FSD just wrecks the Tesla itself or injures the driver of the Tesla (i.e. running int…

Post by dmitriid » Thu, Jan 12, 2023, 9:00 AM UTC

jiriro wrote: post #392

dmitriid wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It takes humans up to 5 seconds to even start breaking in the presence of danger. Even at 40 miles per hour your speed is 58 feet per second (or, at 60kmh you speed is 16 meters per second). So it's either "the driver had sufficient warning" or "the lane change from Tesla was dangerous". As you don't expect cars that are dangerously changing to suddenly slow down.

5 seconds is nonsense. The average driver’s reaction time is 0.2 to 0.3 seconds. This is before the driver’s foot moves. Then there is approx 1 second before the brakes take effect (foot movement, applying the force, brakes responding) So 1.5 second before the car starts breaking. There is a rule of “be at least 2 seconds behind the car in front” which gives a safe distance to handle any emergency braking. Of course…

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jan 12, 2023, 9:02 AM UTC

amelius wrote: post #394

cm2187 wrote: post #385

From what I can tell, the car behind the tesla didn't crash into the tesla but stopped before. And so did the car behind that one. It is the cars after that that crashed into each others. While automatic cars doing random things is certainly problematic, clearly the cause of the crash here isn't the tesla, it is other cars not respecting minimum safety distances and not able to stop when there is a traffic jam ahead.

This is a case of phantom braking, which is illegal. People often forget about the most important traffic rule: it is not allowed to cause an unsafe situation.