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All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

theguardian.com

421–430 of 468 posts

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Muslim, I can assure you there’s no such thing as mystic Islam. Islam is foremost about clarity, simplicity and straightforwardness in its message of pure monotheism. It does not seek to lure people by mesmerising them with incomprehensible riddles. It hides nothing. The so called mystic Islam also known as Sufism, is a deviant sect, and is fundamentally a gateway to polytheism, as it borrows many practices from…

Who decides what orthodox Islam and what is heresy? You'll find Sunnis who think Shiites are heretics, and Shiites who think Sunnis are heretics, and both are major branches of Islam. Of course you'll find both Sunnis and Shiites who think Sufis are heretics, and Sufis who think Sunnis and Shiites are heretics (or at least don't understand the true or secret meaning of the Koran or of Islam). And does the Koran have…

You are correct in assuming that whoever takes the Qur-aan as the central scripture is a Muslim. That’s really all that is to it. I will just add a bit of a historical background. You can read the Prophet’s history to best judge what Islam he brought.

I will start from the basics:

The fundamental word of Islam, the one word which differentiates between who is a Muslim and who is not is the well known Kalima (كلمة) of Islam, La ilaha illallaah. Which translates to there is none worthy of worship except Allaah. This statement encapsulates the entire monotheistic creed of Islam in it. It is the pivot of any Muslim’s religion. A Muslim strives to preserve this statement in his heart while believing in it. He does this by trying to ensure harmony in his speech and his deeds.

One who lacks firm belief in his heart in this word, is a weaker believer than one who has firm belief, even though both might utter the word in the same manner.

Though we can’t see what the heart contains and hence we can’t normally judge a person’s level of faith, his outward actions, to an extent, do communicate his level of belief. So much about this word.

The one who brought this word to the people was a man called Muhammad (upon him be peace) over 14 centuries ago. The people who he first invited to his religion were the people of of his birthplace, the city of Makkah. His people were originally on the religion of Abraham, worshipping the One God of all that exists, Allaah. But in due course of time, they forgot the truth and started worshiping idols.

So Muhammad (upon him be peace) was sent to them as Messenger by Allaah, just as Messengers from among men were sent by Allaah to earlier people, in order to warn them about the consequences of idol worship and to call them to the worship of the true God, Allaah. Some Messengers which were sent before him were Noah, Lot, Moses, Jonah, Jesus, all mentioned in the Bible and Qur-aan.

Muhammad (upon him be peace), warned the people of eternal hell if they did not believe in his Message and desist from idol worship. And he promised Paradise for whoever believed in him and acted upon what he commanded.

His Prophetic Mission lasted 23 years, of which the first 13 were spent in Makkah and the last 10 were in Madinah. He was made a Messenger at the age of 40, and he dies at the age of 63.

Throughout his mission, Allaah sent the Verses of His Book, Al -Qur-aan to guide him and his followers, gradually teaching them the rituals of prayer, charity, pilgrimage. As the Messenger (upon him be peace) and his followers were the subject of great deal of ridicule and torture, Allaah, in these Verses, also supported them and encouraged them. Allaah also taught His Messenger how to present his Message to people in the elegant way.

That’s all I could muster. Wish you best.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#422
post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it disturbing the way a trait that seems to be very common among humans is being framed as a problem. External stimulus means you’re with other humans that you can cooperate with. That you’re sharing stories and learning. That you’re hunting for food. That you’re building a shelter. All these things are necessary for survival. It seems possible that being sociable and industrious might well have been bread int…

It's a problem. That's why doing it (mediation, mindfulness, prayer, sitting zazen, ...) helps ! Watch animals: they meditate instinctively. Dogs, cats, birds, they all do it. Just like animals all stretch instinctively. (We had some chickens for awhile this year and they stretch too. It's funny: they stretch the wing and leg on one side together, then the other side.) What I'm saying is, "yoga" and "meditation" are…

Em... 12,000 years old? Where does this number come from?

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then, you see the truth, of life, existence and the universe. Pretty words, but do they mean anything? For example, if I reach this state, will it be revealed to me why there is something rather than nothing? I think not, otherwise someone would have reported back with the answer already. I'm interested in meditation to learn more about my own body and mind, maybe improve my life somehow. But IMHO the discussions a…

That's basically how they con you into it. Using pretty words which appear to have "deeper" and "transcendental" meanings. They entice you with words like mystery, truth, existence, universe, but the TLDG (Too long didn't go) of this rabbit hole called meditation is (wading in) occult practices.

You first need to get yourself free of the opium of Islam. The unoriginal religion made up by stealing lots and lots of ideas from Judaism and Christianity, themselves sources of much suffering for humankind. The hell and heaven are not of any next worlds but are what you create for yourself and live inside, here on this very Earth. And look at the hellish and backward state of most Muslim counties and their people: People trapped in ignorance, prejudice, poverty in a never ending hellish cycle. If your ideas and beliefs have made this world a living hell for you, how do you expect to die and then wake again in a heaven? The guys that told you so, were really swindlers.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the day you can sit for hours without doing anything, you've attained the state of self-realization – self-love free from all conditions. The conditioned mind is no longer there, the thoughts no longer bombard you, the emotions no longer disturb you. You enjoy the deep peace, contentment and bliss of your infinite self. Then you can truly contemplate deeply on anything you feel important, then the deep mysteries of e…

> Then, you see the truth, of life, existence and the universe. Pretty words, but do they mean anything? For example, if I reach this state, will it be revealed to me why there is something rather than nothing? I think not, otherwise someone would have reported back with the answer already. I'm interested in meditation to learn more about my own body and mind, maybe improve my life somehow. But IMHO the discussions a…

Here's an opinion from a deeply cynical person who's also 15 years deep into this mysticism rabbit hole.

My takeaway is that there's something in this meditation thing. At the very least, concentrating on a static imaginary shape activates some kind of drainage system in the brain: for a few minutes you feel what a clogged pipe would feel when it's being cleaned by a powerful water stream. That effect alone seems valuable.

Regarding the meaning of meditation, my conclusion is that it's a whistle. Just like you'd produce a certain whistle to summon an animal or a bird, you'd sharply imagine a certain shape or symbol to summon ideas or certain effects. The former is how you get inspiration. "Mysticism" begins when you are able to produce this whistle the right way and when you know which thoughts or symbols to target.

The most comprehensive explanation of meditation that's available in English is probably lamrim, volume 4 (500 or so pages, described by its author as a brief summary of key concepts from canonical sources that an interested reader should read himself).

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure that our beliefs aren't "just" (the appropriate equivalent) of a stimulus or data point that has really high weight, e.g. because it was created during childhood and constantly reinforced? Take the biases that we've heard about in image recognition where these ML models misclassify black people. If a person had done that you would accuse them of racist beliefs. Why is the computer model so different? Bec…

Well, what about Gebru's findings? Data in and of itself is not beneficial, we do have certain underlying beliefs about appropriateness and goodness. There is an element of innate belief at play. Otherwise, chatbots are very good at learning abusive and racist language. It's due to our belief that it's not right and decent that we train them using a bias. And it's only due to beliefs that we rein in the rogue AI whic…

Aka every human has the innate ability to distinguish good from evil. This idea is older than dinosaurs.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the TLDG (Too long didn't go) of this rabbit hole called meditation is (wading in) occult practices" What do the words "occult practices" mean to you? Do you consider them bad? If so, why?

Occult practices for me means devil worship and associated rituals. I consider them bad because I consider the devil bad.

That's wrong, though. Occultism didn't have the evil meaning until very recently. That's similar to how nazis have changed the public image of swastika: before them it was an Egyptian symbol of light or something of that sort. "Occult" merely means hidden from plain sight. Coincidentally, the most occult thing out there is hiding in plain sight: it's electricity.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#427

Hate this tiresome retreading like some literary diarrhoea. Some late middled aged white man quoting some dead white men back when white men held all the aces through physical means. The future is women, if we are to exist beyond 2100. At least, after referencing a load of men, the living middle aged man suggests a woman at the end. Tiresomely ignorant.

Small minds discuss people. Average minds discuss events. Great minds discuss ideas.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#428
post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but random search for information is not always a bad thing. There's a time for exploration.

I agree. HN is net positive for me over the many years I’ve been around. But if you want to cut social media, you probably should include HN ;)

At some point I decided that abandoning social media as a whole would be a tremendous task because of years of being 'trained' by tech... Now I separate useful and useless social media. Shaping my perspective this way helps regulate my Internet use a lot.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#429
post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it disturbing the way a trait that seems to be very common among humans is being framed as a problem. External stimulus means you’re with other humans that you can cooperate with. That you’re sharing stories and learning. That you’re hunting for food. That you’re building a shelter. All these things are necessary for survival. It seems possible that being sociable and industrious might well have been bread int…

It's a problem. That's why doing it (mediation, mindfulness, prayer, sitting zazen, ...) helps ! Watch animals: they meditate instinctively. Dogs, cats, birds, they all do it. Just like animals all stretch instinctively. (We had some chickens for awhile this year and they stretch too. It's funny: they stretch the wing and leg on one side together, then the other side.) What I'm saying is, "yoga" and "meditation" are…

Postulating that basic instincts are problematic is too cynical. It doesn't have to be one way or the other. You certainly need somekind of external stimulus to react to the surroundings (e.g fight or flight response). Inward introspection is great but it's just another tool at the end of the day.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's basically how they con you into it. Using pretty words which appear to have "deeper" and "transcendental" meanings. They entice you with words like mystery, truth, existence, universe, but the TLDG (Too long didn't go) of this rabbit hole called meditation is (wading in) occult practices.

You first need to get yourself free of the opium of Islam. The unoriginal religion made up by stealing lots and lots of ideas from Judaism and Christianity, themselves sources of much suffering for humankind. The hell and heaven are not of any next worlds but are what you create for yourself and live inside, here on this very Earth. And look at the hellish and backward state of most Muslim counties and their people:…

You need to first rid your society from the actual opium and its derivatives. It’s very convenient to throw the opium of the masses on Muslims, when the masses in your society have puncture marks.

And yes Marxism has died. Communism is dead. It’s just a name for brutality and dictatorship.

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