Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards • Hacker News Board

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#421

Post by trbvm2 » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:29 AM UTC

cehrnrooth wrote: post #239

dpc59 wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then they charge you for obstruction (or whatever it's called in oklahoma, in french it's called "entrave à un agent de la paix")

That seems questionable, how can they charge you with obstruction when you can just not answer any questions you're not legally obligated to answer.

I tried to write the long answer and it turned out as a wall of text composed of parenthetical caveats. Then I tried to right the short answer and it turned out as a medium length yet confusing answer.

The truth of the matter is that people are barely evolved ape/chimps and do pretty much whatever suites them as long as they don't get their ass kicked for it.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#422

Post by deciplex » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:32 AM UTC

protomyth wrote: post #410

deciplex wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First of all, he didn't call him racist. Secondly, pointing out that for some reason long-standing problems suddenly seem to get a lot more attention once they start negatively affecting white people is not promoting hate - it is calling attention to racism .

First of all, he didn't call him racist. When you start a comment with "well off white guy", you are indicating the person is a racist since they are ignoring problems of their fellow humans because of the person's race. If you substitute any other race in that statement, people would find it to be an accusation of racism. I suppose there is another interpretation of that line, but I am trying very hard to be charita…

The fact remains he did not call him racist, whatever you believe he implied. For someone who claims to try hard at being charitable, I think you should take that into consideration. At the very worst if dsfyu404ed is calling Kyle Loveless a racist, I would have to argue that this particular instance of it is borne of ignorance as opposed to malice, which is an important distinction especially for your claim that he is spreading hate. Pointing out racism borne truly of ignorance is not promoting hate, even if you're wrong on the claim. Claiming a person is racist out of malice is (rightly or wrongly).

If someone (not a minority) is ill-informed about an issue that disproportionately affects minorities, to the point that they believe the issue is not so serious, and only when personally confronted with the effects do they take on a more fully-informed opinion and speak out about the injustice of it, I don't think you necessarily have to consider that person a racist, even if you think their behavior is a result of bias. And, while dsfyu404ed certainly expressed frustration with this state of affairs (as I believe anyone should), that still does not rise to the level of actually calling a person a racist. This need not apply only to race - it can also be rich people not caring about poor people problems, or men not caring about womens' issues, and so on.

For another example look at the opioid epidemic in the US now, compared to crack hysteria in the 80s. Suddenly drug addicts are victims of circumstance, unfairly targeted by unjust or antiquated laws, it's the drug companies' fault for pushing these treatments to doctors, etc. etc. Whereas in the 80s crack dealers were going to infiltrate your nice suburban community and turn your daughters into whores and your sons into foot soldiers in their gang wars, or whatever the hell. And it just so happens that the opioid epidemic is particularly bad among white communities now. However, that doesn't mean that everyone who is concerned about the opioid epidemic now, yet took a different view of the crack epidemic back in the day, is necessarily a racist in the usual sense. It could be they are ignorant of their bias, and lack introspection.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#423

Post by nikdaheratik » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:38 AM UTC

refurb wrote: post #414

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple: pay for things you need. Over the last few decades the American people have been conned into this idea that government is fundamentally too big and needs to be shrunk because of reasons. People save a few measly percentage points on taxes that help pay for the axle damage on their car after being driven over roads that are no longer repaired. Municipalities had to find ways to recoup costs from slashed state…

Municipalities had to find ways to recoup costs from slashed state and federal budgets When was the last time you saw any gov't budget go down? I'd say never. The gov't has more than enough money. The problem is where and how they spend it.

Other than every month in my home state of Kansas. Of course, that is related to much larger issues, but the same thing could be said for a number of other states in the midwest to a lesser degree. And those that aren't going down, are just treading water by pushing the costs down to the local governments.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#424

Post by Crito » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:38 AM UTC

Gibbon1 wrote: post #413

tamana wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know legal protections apply to criminals, but it is hard to win a political battle against the cops who busted a big time dealer of life-destroying drugs (heroin)

Among the friends I knew the body count is Prescription Drugs: 2 Alcohol: 3 Heroin: 0 Methamphetamine: 0 Cannabis: 0 Two people I know. Their brothers both died from Oxycontin(tm). Specifically pulmonary talcosis. You get pulmonary talcosis from the talc government made the manufacturer add specifically to kill junkies.

Heroin: 4 Alcohol: 3

Just because you don't know anyone that heroin has killed, doesn't mean it isn't a problem.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#425

Post by killbrad » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:39 AM UTC

cornchips wrote: post #359

downandout wrote: post #313

Here's a fun little video from the manufacturer extolling the virtues and showing a demo of their device: https://youtu.be/XYbgnCi7NYI These are some truly evil people. Apparently they can only target prepaid cards with this thing, which unsurprisingly will disproportionately affect people with lower incomes (the "unbanked"). According to the manufacturer's FAQ [1]: Intel™ and ERAD-Recovery™ will only retrieve balanc…

Yes, evil. As is Sergeant Rob Hain (of Chicago) who uploaded this... "Sheriff's Deputy Ron Hain improperly detained Marsh after issuing him a warning and continued questioning him when he should have been free to leave, Barsanti ruled. The questioning led to Marsh's admission he was carrying a gun, which prompted further searches of his truck, phones, GPS and eventually the storage lockers." "The discovery was made b…

Just a minor note, he is not from Chicago - it's not even in the same county as Chicago.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#426

Post by Crito » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:41 AM UTC

deciplex wrote: post #422

protomyth wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First of all, he didn't call him racist. When you start a comment with "well off white guy", you are indicating the person is a racist since they are ignoring problems of their fellow humans because of the person's race. If you substitute any other race in that statement, people would find it to be an accusation of racism. I suppose there is another interpretation of that line, but I am trying very hard to be charita…

The fact remains he did not call him racist, whatever you believe he implied. For someone who claims to try hard at being charitable, I think you should take that into consideration. At the very worst if dsfyu404ed is calling Kyle Loveless a racist, I would have to argue that this particular instance of it is borne of ignorance as opposed to malice, which is an important distinction especially for your claim that he…

> "The fact remains he did not call him racist"

This is a pointless charade that fools nobody.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#427

Post by Unklejoe » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:43 AM UTC

Gibbon1 wrote: post #413

tamana wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know legal protections apply to criminals, but it is hard to win a political battle against the cops who busted a big time dealer of life-destroying drugs (heroin)

Among the friends I knew the body count is Prescription Drugs: 2 Alcohol: 3 Heroin: 0 Methamphetamine: 0 Cannabis: 0 Two people I know. Their brothers both died from Oxycontin(tm). Specifically pulmonary talcosis. You get pulmonary talcosis from the talc government made the manufacturer add specifically to kill junkies.

I personally knew 5 people who have died from a drug overdose, and that drug was heroin in all 5 cases.

They all actually started off by abusing prescription opiates, but moved to heroin after they ran out of money.

However, my area is known for being a heroin hot spot. I live in a decent middle class town about 15 minutes away from Camden, NJ. My high school was known as "heroin high".

The problem with heroin is that there's very poor quality control. Overdoses seem to occur under one of the two following circumstances:

1. The person just gets released from rehab and relapses. Their tolerance isn't what it used to be, so their body gets shocked.

2. There's a sudden spike in the strength of the heroin that is "going around". The person may be used to a certain strength, so the more powerful batch can be enough to send them over the edge.

Just figured I'd add my own personal data points since it seemed like you were trying to deemphasize the danger of heroin by pointing out that you don't know anyone who died from it. Maybe, that wasn't your intention, so forgive me if so.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#428

Post by deciplex » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:46 AM UTC

Crito wrote: post #426

deciplex wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact remains he did not call him racist, whatever you believe he implied. For someone who claims to try hard at being charitable, I think you should take that into consideration. At the very worst if dsfyu404ed is calling Kyle Loveless a racist, I would have to argue that this particular instance of it is borne of ignorance as opposed to malice, which is an important distinction especially for your claim that he…

> "The fact remains he did not call him racist" This is a pointless charade that fools nobody.

Sorry, what is the charade? Do white people ignore the problems of minorities in the US or not? If so, is pointing out the fact of it promoting hate?

At any rate, he did not call him a racist. That's not really up for discussion since the text is right there.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#429

Post by nikdaheratik » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 4:50 AM UTC

FireBeyond wrote: post #206

zrail wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Searching for "debit" brings up this: > In addition to presenting the value associated with a card, the terminal will read other card types such as credit and debit cards. While no value can be provided, the terminal will display a “card not supported” message to alert the trooper that this is not a prepaid card. The trooper can then compare the four digits displayed on the terminal with the last four digits shown on…

"I'm not really sure why they compare the last 4 digits to detect a clone, that seems wrong to me." It catches lazy counterfeiting. Stamp a whole bunch of cards with the same number and info, while the magstripe is what gets read and is the real account you're stealing from, the theory being that no-one really cares about the number printed on the card. Some retailers do this too, ask or enter the last four of the ca…

More than that, in the case of cards that use the credit card numbering system, instead of just ordinary bank cards, the number itself is algorithmically generated and the last 4 digits (specifically the very last one) act as a kind of hash check (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luhn_algorithm). Not that police or cashiers are likely to know that.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#430

Post by chiaro » Thu, Jun 09, 2016, 5:09 AM UTC

moribondus wrote: post #380

The police will keep encroaching until they meet some kind of resistance, which will not easily materialize because people here would be the first ones to utterly condemn respect-instilling reprisals. If everybody else around you accepts to get arbitrarily molested in the butt, you either accept it too, or else you move out. I have personally chosen to move out. Unfortunately, you can see the United Nations, USAID, i…

Why not go to any Western country with a functional police force? e.g. the UK, Australia, Sweden