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Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

developer.apple.com

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Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#411

Post by danielheath »

jeroenhd wrote: post #40
anarchogeek wrote: post #27

What about inmutable systems? My app (using scuttlebutt) creates an 'account' but it's located as crypto keys only within the app and apple keychain. So far the apple reviewers refused to believe that it works like. It's open source, they've got the code... but still.... Same is true for anything crypto. The account as it were exists on many devices, but it's not something you as the app creator can manage. I think a…

This is why using the blockchain got user data is such a stupid idea. The immutability makes it impossible to redact or remove information, even if that information is encrypted. The same is true foor P2P services where there is no central accounting system. Deleting the account shouldn't be a problem if all the "account" info is stored on the device itself, so if your reviewers aren't completely incompetent I don't…

It’s not a blockchain, it’s a merkle tree.

You could probably get away with signing an “implode” message and appending it to the tree, instructing any conforming client to wipe the account upon receipt (or at least cease to retransmit). That would give users the option to request their data be removed.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#412

Post by onion2k »

xg15 wrote: post #286
barsonme wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If AES is broken in your lifetime, you're going to have _way_ bigger problems than somebody decrypting your blockchain ciphertext. And if you're not encrypting data with AES (or one of a handful of other algorithms), then you should be worried _now_.

If all of AES, then yes. But a particular choice of algorithm parameters can become insecure much earlier. > If AES is broken in your lifetime, you're going to have _way_ bigger problems than somebody decrypting your blockchain ciphertext. I'm not so sure about that. Not a lot of encrypted data is simply lying around at rest, available for everyone to run attacks against. Most encrypted data is either ephemeral (encr…

AES being broken doesn't mean someone managed to brute force a key. It means someone found a flaw that enables them to break any key in much less time than you'd expect a brute force attack to take. In other words, if AES is broken people would be able to read that ephemeral data quickly enough for it to be useful.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#413

Post by barsonme »

xg15 wrote: post #286
barsonme wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If AES is broken in your lifetime, you're going to have _way_ bigger problems than somebody decrypting your blockchain ciphertext. And if you're not encrypting data with AES (or one of a handful of other algorithms), then you should be worried _now_.

If all of AES, then yes. But a particular choice of algorithm parameters can become insecure much earlier. > If AES is broken in your lifetime, you're going to have _way_ bigger problems than somebody decrypting your blockchain ciphertext. I'm not so sure about that. Not a lot of encrypted data is simply lying around at rest, available for everyone to run attacks against. Most encrypted data is either ephemeral (encr…

That’s a very optimistic opinion :)

And just to nitpick about blockchains, ledgers, etc.: they don’t need to be world-readable. You can protect them the same as you would a regular database.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#414

Post by O-stevns »

ryantgtg wrote: post #215
wbobeirne wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, it's closer to 4 months, and it would appear that they won't yank you immediately. It's only for new submissions: > This requirement applies to all app submissions starting January 31, 2022. Unsure if this means new apps, or includes updates to existing apps. But I bet there'll be a bit more of a grace period if you don't have a new update to push.

Plus, “initiate deletion of their account from within the app” sounds like the app can simply link to whatever account deletion functionality you have on your website.

I don't think that's right, but the policy and the article doesn't answer these questions particularly well, so it's very much up to interpretation... The problem with linking to a website is that it doesn't make anything better for the user, since that could be either directing to a form, a support phone number or mail. Neither which improve the situation because the user is not in control.

if you provide a good and easy sign in functionality from your app, through native UI and the like, then you should be able to provide the same functionality for deleting that same account. That is at least what we have recommended one of our clients, but that client is also a public transport company, so they can't afford to be in gray area where the app is either rejected or taken down.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#415

Post by onion2k »

Hermel wrote: post #68
anarchogeek wrote: post #27

What about inmutable systems? My app (using scuttlebutt) creates an 'account' but it's located as crypto keys only within the app and apple keychain. So far the apple reviewers refused to believe that it works like. It's open source, they've got the code... but still.... Same is true for anything crypto. The account as it were exists on many devices, but it's not something you as the app creator can manage. I think a…

Blockchain wallets are an interesting case. I would argue that for example an Ethereum wallet that generates an address for you in the Ethereum system is not required to provide a way to delete that account again. Similarly, the Chrome app is not required to allow you to delete your hackernews account even though you created it using the Chrome app. Generally, if an app enables you to create an account in a system co…

Generally, if an app enables you to create an account in a system controlled by someone else, the account deletion rule shouldn’t be applicable

The post you're replying to says Apple believe it should. Unless you can persuade Apple to change their policy, it won't matter if you disagree.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#416

Post by onion2k »

grishka wrote: post #310
floatingatoll wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your app is incompatible with the Apple App Store. There’s a lot of arguments that people will make about whether this is justified or not, but from a plain rules standpoint, that’s not a permissible data management strategy if you want to publish an iOS app through Apple’s store.

What if you're making an unofficial, unaffiliated app for someone else's service, and their API/protocol doesn't support deleting accounts?

Then you won't be able to continue making that app.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#417

Post by Liquidor »

CrlNvl wrote: post #390

While this is great news for B2C users/apps, I'm not sure this is ideal for B2B users/apps. I guess you don't want an employee to be able to delete his pro account without any checks.

From the wording in the guidelines, just don't let the employee create the account through the app (shouldn't be a thing for employees anyway).

Basically: App allows account creation => App must allow account deletion.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#418

Post by robin_reala »

CrlNvl wrote: post #390

While this is great news for B2C users/apps, I'm not sure this is ideal for B2B users/apps. I guess you don't want an employee to be able to delete his pro account without any checks.

The page doesn’t say that users have to be able to delete their account within the app, it says that companies “must also allow users to initiate deletion of their account from within the app”. Checks are totally fine.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#420

Post by xg15 »

barsonme wrote: post #413
xg15 wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all of AES, then yes. But a particular choice of algorithm parameters can become insecure much earlier. > If AES is broken in your lifetime, you're going to have _way_ bigger problems than somebody decrypting your blockchain ciphertext. I'm not so sure about that. Not a lot of encrypted data is simply lying around at rest, available for everyone to run attacks against. Most encrypted data is either ephemeral (encr…

That’s a very optimistic opinion :) And just to nitpick about blockchains, ledgers, etc.: they don’t need to be world-readable. You can protect them the same as you would a regular database.

> You can protect them the same as you would a regular database.

Then you'll need some central entity to manage access to the chain. If you already have a central entity, you can just use a regular database instead of a blockchain and save yourself all the energy waste.

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