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The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

theatlantic.com

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Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#41

Post by cylinder »

ogdenyogly wrote: post #38

This article only focuses on one aspect of "busy" -- working. The real problem is "time inflation." This is the name given to the fact that there is more to DO than ever because life is generally becoming more complicated, and because companies and government entities have decided to make you responsible for large portions of their business processes as a cost saving measure. Government is always the worst since the…

>* Purposefully poorly designed store ques. In the US most store ques are about 30% less efficient than optimal and all is required is a slight redesign of the area. The correct type of store que is where there is one line that feeds all registers-- in that way nobody can get stuck behind a customer whose taking a long time. (Think Fry's vs. Costco). I shop as much as I can online but cannot purchase groceries online obviously.

Just to let you know, Whole Foods does this in its New York stores. Oh, and you can order groceries online here, Google will deliver stuff from Target, Costco, etc in the same day, public transportation is good and fast. Next time, tell the weed whacker manufacturer to screw themselves and honor their warranty or you'll file a Deceptive Trade Practices Act suit; you're not their diagnostician.

Add to your list: reading social link aggregation sites and writing long comments on them :)

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#42

Post by cylinder »

cryoshon wrote: post #26
nowlnowl wrote: post #4

As a European I am always amazed how much the US-citizen work. Very little vacation, very little security and a atmosphere of a very (very very, haha) competetive nature.

Yeah, it's absolutely disgusting how desperate and beaten down the American proliteriat is. We have to ask permission to take vacation or sick days, and both are frowned upon. How long you are seen to be working is a very important statistic for workplace prestige, far eclipsing the actual amount or quality of work done. It's important to be seen working long hours, that way when the lay-offs come (and they will come…

You are right, and not exaggerating; the workplace culture is more toxic than the labor laws themselves.

In the US, the capital is the big winner (business owner, investors, etc.) Labor loses hard -- even if you are a highly paid professional you are still going to succumb to an unsustainable culture that ruins your QOL.

And please, nobody counter this with stories about how your cool startup or tech job isn't like that. I'm talking about the majority, not various niches and exceptions to the rules.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#43

Post by eshvk »

JPKab wrote: post #21
bitL wrote: post #11

I have a feeling that "being busy" is just a gentle form of crowd control. I could see it in Japan, people being terribly busy at work, yet producing very little, spending most of the time during the day at job, unable to do anything in their spare time. I guess that's how Asian society makes sure there is no unexpected creativity leading to "interesting times". It could also help individual people to cope with socia…

I've noticed that a lot of the "busiest" people are the least productive. I suspect its a defense mechanism for people who, at least on a subconscious level, realize how unproductive and meaningless their job and/or output at a job really is. My wife's sister and her husband are both the two "busiest" people you will ever meet. Yet when I spend time with them, I'm reminded of the fact that neither of them is very int…

Good lord man. The arrogance and superiority complex that you have towards other human beings is breathtaking. I don't know you from heck but I feel the need to become more humble just to reduce the amount of dickishness in the world.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#44

Post by eshvk »

nowlnowl wrote: post #4

As a European I am always amazed how much the US-citizen work. Very little vacation, very little security and a atmosphere of a very (very very, haha) competetive nature.

Oh please, enough with this already. I work in the U.S. for a European company. Those who are competitive are competitive irrespective of nationality or culture; it transcends the atlantic. It is not like there is a magical government employee nature of things in Europe either.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#45

Post by eshvk »

Malarkey73 wrote: post #2

I'm not really sure what this "work-hours" data is capturing. My parents were teachers and I remember them marking after school and some weekends. My wife is now a teacher and she has after school meetings at least once a week, spends hours marking every night and weekends, plus a lot of her holiday preparing new lessons and admin. Contractually she has the exact same hours and holidays my parents had but her life is…

> My parents were teachers and I remember them marking after school and some weekends. My wife is now a teacher and she has after school meetings at least once a week, spends hours marking every night and weekends, plus a lot of her holiday preparing new lessons and admin. Contractually she has the exact same hours and holidays my parents had but her life is nothing like theirs.

Same experience here. This was in the middle of Africa yet students will have to be graded and life has to go on.

> Now this seems to have been pushed back to an ever receding horizon and people work long long hours competing to get the next grant or next placement, to keep their heads above water right up till retirement.

In the U.S. academia is not that competitive after tenure (most of the time). Of course, you may have a drive to have students, which may drive you to acquire grants and so on.

> I guess its anecdotal but I see the same sort of things amongst my friends in tech and pharma.

My experience in tech has been an upward increase in work load with increase in experience. Funnily enough this has been correlated with greater freedom. The less freedom I had, the more I was inclined to put in my 8 hours and check out. Now, the more the freedom that I have, the more I realize that I am always on and I have to force myself to switch off and do other things.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#46

Post by jff »

Dewie wrote: post #36
jff wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You had recess in high school?

I had breaks. That's what I meant. What did you think I meant? Something other than that? Or where you just being a pedant?

Sorry, I was being sincere. We had "recess" in elementary school, where we'd go out for 15-30 minutes and play. If you meant the 5 minute breaks between classes I don't remember what we called them, probably breaks. I wondered if you went to some odd high school that had breaks to go play in the fields.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#47

Post by JPKab »

mreiland wrote: post #30
JPKab wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've noticed that a lot of the "busiest" people are the least productive. I suspect its a defense mechanism for people who, at least on a subconscious level, realize how unproductive and meaningless their job and/or output at a job really is. My wife's sister and her husband are both the two "busiest" people you will ever meet. Yet when I spend time with them, I'm reminded of the fact that neither of them is very int…

maybe you should stop judging your wife's sister and her husband, and/or start being as critical of yourselves as you are of them.

Perhaps I am judgmental towards them. Recently we had a big argument because they both saw nothing wrong with innocent people being wrongfully executed, and view it as a necessary evil to allow for guilty to be executed.

The fact that they both told my wife that they feel art is a waste of time and that artists should all find better things to do didn't help me view them as remotely on our level.

I'm very critical of myself. It is people who lack the capacity to be critical of themselves who act and think like they do. I am better than they are, and I'm not ashamed to admit it. I'm not better than them by anything given to me, but because I recognize that I suck and constantly seek to improve myself. They view themselves as amazing people. They aren't.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#48

Post by JPKab »

eshvk wrote: post #43
JPKab wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've noticed that a lot of the "busiest" people are the least productive. I suspect its a defense mechanism for people who, at least on a subconscious level, realize how unproductive and meaningless their job and/or output at a job really is. My wife's sister and her husband are both the two "busiest" people you will ever meet. Yet when I spend time with them, I'm reminded of the fact that neither of them is very int…

Good lord man. The arrogance and superiority complex that you have towards other human beings is breathtaking. I don't know you from heck but I feel the need to become more humble just to reduce the amount of dickishness in the world.

If you don't know me "from heck", then perhaps you should dial down the rhetoric before you assume I'm arrogant towards other human beings.

I used to be a construction worker. I know what arrogance towards human beings looks like because I experienced it every day by being looked at like an insect by every white collar asshole that walked by. I also know that my wife's sister and her husband didn't think I was good enough for her back then, but now that I make a decent salary they think I'm kosher. Fuck them.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#49

Post by mreiland »

JPKab wrote: post #47
mreiland wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

maybe you should stop judging your wife's sister and her husband, and/or start being as critical of yourselves as you are of them.

Perhaps I am judgmental towards them. Recently we had a big argument because they both saw nothing wrong with innocent people being wrongfully executed, and view it as a necessary evil to allow for guilty to be executed. The fact that they both told my wife that they feel art is a waste of time and that artists should all find better things to do didn't help me view them as remotely on our level. I'm very critical of…

The arrogance of humility.

Re: The Myth That Americans Are Busier Than Ever

#50

Post by Dewie »

jff wrote: post #46
Dewie wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had breaks. That's what I meant. What did you think I meant? Something other than that? Or where you just being a pedant?

Sorry, I was being sincere. We had "recess" in elementary school, where we'd go out for 15-30 minutes and play. If you meant the 5 minute breaks between classes I don't remember what we called them, probably breaks. I wondered if you went to some odd high school that had breaks to go play in the fields.

Sure, we had 5 minutes or whatever short breaks between classes. Though I said that I was "busy" during all periods of free time that I had to spend within the school (lunches, free hours, etc.), so I don't think the distinction matters in this case. :)

(For that matter: I didn't really go to "high school", I'm just using that as the name for my school system's equivalent of year 11 to 13.)

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