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Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

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Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#41

Post by talmand »

thrownaway2424 wrote: post #30
georgemcbay wrote: post #21

I work close to a fairly rare "no right on red" (in California right on red is legal unless signs prohibit it) intersection. Without fail, near the end of the month there will be a cop car sitting under the bridge overlooking the turn for hours just waiting for someone to make the turn. Shamelessly sitting there, in the dark and under a bridge, blocking half the rightmost lane of a busy street, causing a far greater…

So you sympathize with people who can't be bothered to observe posted traffic regulations?

He's not sympathizing with those people, he's pointing out the police officer that can't be bothered to observe posted traffic regulations.

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#43

Post by kunai »

This is unsafe for pedestrians.

The yellow light means "Clear the intersection," not "Slow down." The purpose is to give time to people crossing the sidewalks to finish walking over to the other side. Shortening them is a safety hazard for pedestrians like me who don't own a vehicle.

I don't live in Florida, but this is shameful and disgusting.

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#44

Post by flogic »

doki_pen wrote: post #32
joshuamerrill wrote: post #10

There's an inherent conflict of interest when cities, counties, and states rely on traffic tickets as a source of revenue. The all-too-tempting incentive is to maximize that revenue, either by abusing civil rights or, in this case, by endangering public safety.

It won't necessarily endanger the public if they add more delay between one light turning red and the other turning green.

If people stop harder, they're more likely to get in an accident doing so. If you don't have ABS, stopping harder increases the odds that you'll skid. Also you're more likely to get rear ended if the person behind you isn't paying attention.

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#45

Post by chm »

thrownaway2424 wrote: post #40
roboneal wrote: post #27

An appropriate partial quote of Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged: “Did you really think we want those laws observed?" said Dr. Ferris. "We want them to be broken." "But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced or objectively interpreted – and you create a nation of law-breakers – and then you cash in on guilt."

After you turn 14 you'll realize there is actually never an appropriate moment for an Ayn Rand quote.

I have never read Ayn Rand, but I have heard of her before.

Why are such quotes inappropriate?

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#46

Post by abduhl »

kstenerud wrote: post #15
bryanlarsen wrote: post #5

If they increased the "all-red" time to match, then good for Florida. They've increased their revenues, their roads are safer, and those who are running yellows are getting what they deserve. Running yellows is illegal and far too common. If they didn't increase the all-red time they are making the roads more dangerous. People get accustomed to the length of the yellow & all-red time. But if the total doesn't change,…

Lengthening the yellow light duration reduces the number of red light violations: http://www.motorists.org/red-light-cameras/timing-myths Even worse: Red light cameras make intersections LESS safe by INCREASING accident rates: http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/18/1835.asp http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2012/11/red-light_cameras_l... This only makes sense since you're removing decision power from the person most qual…

Your first link is a red herring. We are trying to increase safety, not reduce red light violations.

Your other two links make a common mistake in traffic safety debates by assuming that an increase in accident rates is a decrease in safety. Look at the types of accidents that are increased or reduced by red light cameras and you'll see that they generally do make intersections safer by reducing high speed, side impact collisions. This comes at the cost of increased low speed collisions, namely people running into someone's bumper as they slam on their brakes to avoid the red light ticket which is a psychological (risk aversion) problem, not a problem with the technology itself.

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#47

Post by sehugg »

I think short yellows are dangerous, especially with loaded vehicles. US DOT should set standards for minimum yellow light times. Here is one such proposal: http://www.shortyellowlights.com/standards/

EDIT: Linked to proposed standard and equation

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#48

Post by doki_pen »

I wonder how it would be if we eliminated yellow lights altogether and instead had a countdown on the green light. At the very least it might save gas, as you could see that the green light ahead will turn red long before you could hope to hit the intersection, so you could coast in. Of course, you'd need to have an adequate "all-red" time for it to not be dangerous.

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#49

Post by walid »

I keep hearing this a lot but if I was "embroiled" in all of this, I would sue the state for entrapment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entrapment

Excerpt:

Two competing tests exist for determining whether entrapment has taken place, known as the "subjective" and "objective" tests. The "subjective" test looks at the defendant's state of mind; entrapment can be claimed if the defendant had no "predisposition" to commit the crime. The "objective" test looks instead at the government's conduct; entrapment occurs when the actions of government officers would have caused a normally law-abiding person to commit a crime.

Re: Florida shortened yellow lights to increase red light camera revenue [video]

#50

Post by danpat »

itg wrote: post #22

I can't wait for self-driving cars to become commonplace. Wonder how much of a hit these departments that rely so much on red light camera and speeding tickets will take.

It's not only that. A good buddy of mine is a criminal defence lawyer. He says that a goodly portion of his drug-related cases begin with traffic stops. By goodly portion, I mean 50+%.

We've talked about it at length. There would be major changes in law enforcement practices if automated cars obviated trivial traffic law enforcement stops.

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