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SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

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Re: SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

#41

Post by gigatree »

ecshafer wrote: post #36
gigatree wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow I’ve never seen someone else in the wild talk about this, it’s like a collective psychosis. Every time I hear “the founding fathers would be turning in their grave if they saw this corruption” I roll my eyes. The MO since the beginning has been propaganda and war. You must not be American?

jfc are you kidding? They teach how bad America is in public schools. A People's History of the United States has sold millions of copies. This must be satire since if anything the discourse is much more about how America is fundamentally corrupt.

American public schools? Since when? All I remember is “they threw tea in the harbor because taxes were so bad” and “George Washington just wanted everyone to finally have freedom”. Yes they teach about slavery and Chinese labor, but I’m talking about the founding myth specifically.

Re: SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

#42

Post by rayiner »

boznz wrote: post #12

Thank you for this, I'm going to give it a read. I am unfortunately very bearish on politics in general. All politicians think short term, look after themselves, their families, their friends, and their interests first; Facts, and working simulations just get in the way. (I am still looking for a politician that is an exception to this rule) Human nature is unfortunately real, and the only way I can see to "solve pol…

You should read Plato's Republic and Aristotle's Politics. This was a known problem 2,400 years ago.

https://classics.mit.edu/Aristotle/politics.html

https://www.sciencetheearth.com/uploads/2/4/6/5/24658156/pla...

Re: SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

#43

Post by Lord-Jobo »

left-struck wrote: post #19
boznz wrote: post #12

Thank you for this, I'm going to give it a read. I am unfortunately very bearish on politics in general. All politicians think short term, look after themselves, their families, their friends, and their interests first; Facts, and working simulations just get in the way. (I am still looking for a politician that is an exception to this rule) Human nature is unfortunately real, and the only way I can see to "solve pol…

I think a better way to run a democracy might be to have our leaders chosen at random. Sounds like a joke, but I’m serious: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sortition

Certainly I think it’s something worth actually trying in the modern age. We’ve had quite a long run now of the representative democracy, I think we should all be open to talking about and trialing these “okay so what’s next?” Options. Before crisis or collapse makes the decision for us.

Re: SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

#44

Post by Lord-Jobo »

mckelveyf wrote: post #39
amelius wrote: post #31

Looking forward to "modeling the economy with AI agents".

The nuance that kept me from spinning out in writing the book was the assumption that politics is weird, and not the same as the economy.

The economy is deeply weird and irrational too. In many of the same ways as politics.

Re: SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

#45

Post by Hammershaft »

boznz wrote: post #12

Thank you for this, I'm going to give it a read. I am unfortunately very bearish on politics in general. All politicians think short term, look after themselves, their families, their friends, and their interests first; Facts, and working simulations just get in the way. (I am still looking for a politician that is an exception to this rule) Human nature is unfortunately real, and the only way I can see to "solve pol…

I think it's less that politicians think short term, and more that voters think short term. Politicians are just responding to the incentives created by willfully ignorant voters.

Re: SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

#46

Post by reactordev »

gigatree wrote: post #41
ecshafer wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

jfc are you kidding? They teach how bad America is in public schools. A People's History of the United States has sold millions of copies. This must be satire since if anything the discourse is much more about how America is fundamentally corrupt.

American public schools? Since when? All I remember is “they threw tea in the harbor because taxes were so bad” and “George Washington just wanted everyone to finally have freedom”. Yes they teach about slavery and Chinese labor, but I’m talking about the founding myth specifically.

You didn't learn about the Delaware Indians? Ohio valley? Cherokee or Tuskarora? How they fought for the British side as they saw American settlers as wanting to take their land (which was correct). The stamp act? The tea tax of just 0.02 that Boston decided, nah, and dumped into the harbor. It started with grievances and ended with the Spanish Fleet. It changed the world, not just founding America. (I got public education in the 80s/90s so YMMV).

Re: SimPolitics: America’s quest to solve politics with computers

#47

Post by ecshafer »

gigatree wrote: post #41
ecshafer wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

jfc are you kidding? They teach how bad America is in public schools. A People's History of the United States has sold millions of copies. This must be satire since if anything the discourse is much more about how America is fundamentally corrupt.

American public schools? Since when? All I remember is “they threw tea in the harbor because taxes were so bad” and “George Washington just wanted everyone to finally have freedom”. Yes they teach about slavery and Chinese labor, but I’m talking about the founding myth specifically.

The founding myth was not talked about at all in new york state high school. They were clear it was about western expansion, and taxes, and led by the local american aristocracy. Every single period emphasized labor, women, and minority treatment. Perhaps this was because I did AP, but this was pretty consistent even in middle school american history also. Its in my opinion that they should have focused more on the founding myths and righteousness of the cause, as that builds civil engagement more.
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