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Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

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Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#41

Post by pj_mukh »

jeremywho wrote: post #25
pj_mukh wrote: post #6

Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.

> this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI This story wouldn't exist without flock cameras constantly surveilling the public...cameras have EVERYTHING to do with this story.

"Law enforcement is setting up a multi-county dragnet by putting every version or mistype of a license plate into a warrant list"

wouldn't be a story? It should be! We should have a higher standard for the people with guns and a badge on the street.

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#42

Post by munk-a »

pj_mukh wrote: post #6

Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.

I simply don't understand why our legal system needs a non-deterministic agent injected into it. What value are we trying to capture that isn't already delivered by our overbearing amount of surveillance.

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#43

Post by LocalH »

munk-a wrote: post #42
pj_mukh wrote: post #6

Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.

I simply don't understand why our legal system needs a non-deterministic agent injected into it. What value are we trying to capture that isn't already delivered by our overbearing amount of surveillance.

The ability to do less actual work and still get arrests

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#44

Post by TheMagicHorsey »

pj_mukh wrote: post #6

Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.

Law enforcement being lazy, dumb, and incompetent is not an unpredictable bug. Its predictable. The smartest human capital does not go into law enforcement in this country. They go to other industries. Flock needs to have procedures for whitelisting plates when errors are discovered because these kinds of issues are very common.

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#45

Post by jumpconc »

LocalH wrote: post #30
virissimo wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not insane at all to return both in a lookup. The "reporting person" will often be wrong about slight variations when calling in a license plate and the downside of errors are asymmetric: it is much more dangerous for the officer to think a driver doesn't have a warrant when they do versus thinking they have a warrant when they don't.

Let's just arrest everyone then - I'm sure they've committed a crime of some kind during their life. We're approximately halfway down the slippery slope, and I don't see any way out other than hard revolution, which is very touchy talk on the internet. Ultimately it's all modern capitalism's fault, else there would be much less incentive for these companies to fuel what is rapidly becoming the effective Fourth Reich

You can talk about revolution on the internet. You can't talk about revolution on websites owned by the current elite, such as this one.

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#46

Post by LocalH »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #18
LocalH wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say the employees should be imprisoned. I said the c-suite, the ones actually in charge. They're enabling these cops to be lazy and not do their job properly, and have directly contributed to numerous human rights violations.

C Suite are employees too. I do not see them breaking any laws, but I do see government employees abusing their power, if not breaking the law.

Sure, and Elon Musk is just a Twitter employee

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#47

Post by mlmonkey »

jeremywho wrote: post #25
pj_mukh wrote: post #6

Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.

> this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI This story wouldn't exist without flock cameras constantly surveilling the public...cameras have EVERYTHING to do with this story.

This wouldn't be a story if the cops did not put the wrong license plate in the system. How is it Flock's fault? Flock is just doing what it is being asked to do!

Let me put in simple terms: Flock flags license plates that are given to it. Someone, somewhere says, license plate "ABCD1234" has a warrant out. And guess what, if Flock sees that plate, it _will_ flag it each. and. every. time!

Tomorrow, say an "Amber Alert" is issued for a pink Ford Taurus with plate "PINKLADY" (when in fact it was a red Taurus with the plate "MADLAD"). Don't you think anyone driving around in a pink Ford Taurus with that plate should be pulled over?

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#48

Post by jumpconc »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #18
LocalH wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say the employees should be imprisoned. I said the c-suite, the ones actually in charge. They're enabling these cops to be lazy and not do their job properly, and have directly contributed to numerous human rights violations.

C Suite are employees too. I do not see them breaking any laws, but I do see government employees abusing their power, if not breaking the law.

C-Suite are the top level of the company. Above them is only the board of directors, whose power is limited to firing the C-Suite if they don't like what they're doing. In day to day operations, the C-Suite controls the entire company.

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#49

Post by LocalH »

pj_mukh wrote: post #41
jeremywho wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI This story wouldn't exist without flock cameras constantly surveilling the public...cameras have EVERYTHING to do with this story.

"Law enforcement is setting up a multi-county dragnet by putting every version or mistype of a license plate into a warrant list" wouldn't be a story? It should be! We should have a higher standard for the people with guns and a badge on the street.

Flock is the problem too because their system is enabling the rights violations to scale up.

Re: Flock cameras keep telling police a man who doesn't have a warrant has a warrant

#50

Post by harwoodr »

AlexandrB wrote: post #31
pj_mukh wrote: post #6

Paraphrasing the crux of the issue: "It's regular practice in Colorado to list license plates with both versions, the one with 'O's and the other with Zeros in the warrant list." Insane. Practice. As always, this story has have nothing to do with the cameras or AI, but "law enforcement has an insane lazy practice" doesn't make for a very good headline anymore.

The insane practice was allowing "O" and "0" to be used in license plate numbers in the first place. Once you do that, you're stuck dealing with the fallout of trying to distinguish confusing glyphs at distance on a moving vehicle. Many places omit letters that can be confused like this for good reason - e.g. Ontario plates can't have the letters G, I, O, Q, and U.

My Ontario green plate starts with GV...
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