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The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

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Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#41

Post by tastyface »

RickJWagner wrote: post #40
neilv wrote: post #23

Besides external PR, does anyone know how this affects internal morale? Some of the earlier Red Hat people I knew would not be OK with working on weapons systems even under the most legitimate circumstances. And they'd be much more opposed to collaborating with fascist regimes. And I think horrified by the idea of shoveling AI slop and grifter hype into life&death decisions. Of course the tech industry makeup has cha…

Former Red Hatter here. People who use terms like ‘fascist regime’ don’t get consideration. That’s like someone on the other side referring to ‘unprincipled savages’. Name calling just doesn’t win. Maybe it makes the name caller feel better, but it loses the audience.

[flagged]

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#42

Post by tastyface »

tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #26
SoftTalker wrote: post #15

> I don’t think there’s something inherently wrong with working together with your nation’s military or defense companies, but that all hinges on what, exactly, said military is doing and how those defense companies’ products are being used. The focus should be on national defense, aid during disasters, and responding to the legitimate requests of sovereign, democratic nations to come to their defense The core purpos…

> and the world is controlled by the people who can do that better than others Yes, welcome to Earth. There's absolutely no morality in deciding to be weaker than you have to be. If you are eaten by a predator when you had the option not to be eaten, you're not some high-minded righteous peace-lover, you're simply dead.

This directly contradicts most religions, which the people with the biggest weapons somehow claim to follow.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#43

Post by text0404 »

nomel wrote: post #34
breppp wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your links talk about the places that were bombed, but I don't see anything apart for conjecture that this was the product of AI targeting. Also this is a vast underestimate of the ability of organizations that were able to locate most of Iranian leadership throughout the war in their hiding places, but suddenly their Farsi is so bad they need a twitter account to tell them this is a Park

It's a popular conspiracy theory, without evidence, and without any perspective on any information that intelligence had. Using civilians as shields is well documented/known for Iranian military and groups they sponsor. For example, hospitals [1]. Shitty, but possibly a valid military target. [1] https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/8666/yemen-human-shields

> Gatestone Institute is an American far-right think tank known for publishing anti-Muslim articles.

> The organization has attracted attention for publishing false or inaccurate articles, some of which were shared widely.

> The Gatestone Institute has been frequently described as anti-Muslim, regularly publishes false reports to stoke anti-Muslim fears, and has published false stories pertaining to Muslims and Islam.

- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gatestone_Institute

The US and Israel have repeatedly claimed that schools and hospitals are legitimate military targets with no evidence. A highly partisan think tank which is known for putting out misinformation is not a valid source.

If you're going to destroy hospitals and target civilian infrastructure and kill children, you should be accountable on a world stage and provide evidence. Unless you would you accept Iran bombing elementary schools in the US because they claim to have intel that there are terrorists hiding under them?

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#44

Post by neilv »

RickJWagner wrote: post #40
neilv wrote: post #23

Besides external PR, does anyone know how this affects internal morale? Some of the earlier Red Hat people I knew would not be OK with working on weapons systems even under the most legitimate circumstances. And they'd be much more opposed to collaborating with fascist regimes. And I think horrified by the idea of shoveling AI slop and grifter hype into life&death decisions. Of course the tech industry makeup has cha…

Former Red Hatter here. People who use terms like ‘fascist regime’ don’t get consideration. That’s like someone on the other side referring to ‘unprincipled savages’. Name calling just doesn’t win. Maybe it makes the name caller feel better, but it loses the audience.

I was characterizing the objections I think some people would've had, from their perspective. Not trying to make a persuasive argument to people not already onboard with those perspectives.

But to one of your points: in some cases, it's not name-calling, but an objective assessment. And "fascist regime" and "collaboration" have historical meaning. I suggest that people of integrity would do well to consider the connotations. Especially at IBM, which infamously was a collaborator with one of the worst fascist regimes. "Never again" should still be in the minds of every executive and board member.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#45

Post by lostlogin »

shwaj wrote: post #35
lostlogin wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is one more layer - America voted for this.

In fact, it didn’t. Trump continued to make “no new wars” a plank of his platform. Some of his base will follow wherever he goes, but he would not have been elected without those who supported him on the basis of this (broken) promise.

Trump said this wasn’t a war.

Americans voted for this confrontational, disrespectful, and chaotic way of governing.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#46

Post by xg15 »

nickdothutton wrote: post #3

Better to have smart bombs than dumb ones. Or rather, better to have 1 smart bomb than 1000 dumb ones spread across an entire city in order to pick off the particular building, vehicle, or person you want.

The reality looks more like the worst of both worlds to me.

If you genuinely needed only a handful of "surgical strikes", thete would be no need to "compress the kill cycle".

What we see in Gaza, Lebanon and Iran looks more like "smart carpet bombing": Some AI system generates a continuous stream of "targets" from sensor and intelligence data, according to whatever criteria political leadership defines and according to a given level of allowed "collateral damage", then those targets are immediately fed to drones or warplanes to destroy - essentially a continuous "pipeline" that probably "ideally" (in the dreams of those people) should become fully automated.

For THAT kind of vision, "efficiency" in destroying any particular target and checking all legally required boxes as quickly as possible is probably paramount.

(And in addition to that, there are probably still enough "dumb bombs" if no one is looking)

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#47

Post by mmh0000 »

It's weird to me that this is "suddenly" an issue.

It has been known for decades that Red Hat Inc's largest customer is the U.S. Army[1]. It's a very large part of the reason why Red Hat took over development of SELinux and made it on by default in their distros.

And the Army isn't exactly known for handing out cupcakes...

[1] https://unixdigest.com/includes/files/Army-RedHat-Whitepaper...

[1] "Red Hat’s partnership with the U.S. Army spans 10 years starting with the deployment of Red Hat Enterprise Linux in 2002 and, to this day, the U.S. Army remains one of Red Hat’s largest customers by volume."

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#48

Post by nailer »

gillesjacobs wrote: post #7

https://web.archive.org/web/20260402155236/https://www.redha... Archive URL to original paper

It’s low latency for realtime. Discussion of these things have been public for twenty years since Red hat released MRG, and this is a conspiracy theory website.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#49

Post by mmh0000 »

eqvinox wrote: post #12
Qem wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Specially AI Hallucination bombs, that hit a park named "Police Park", because it thinks it's killing policemen[1], or a children school with Shahed in the name[2], because it thinks It has something to do with drones. [1] https://x.com/MarioNawfal/status/2029575052535173364 [2] https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/3/6/elementary-school-in...

There's also a chasm of (non-)accountability. You or your subordinates target an elementary school: that's a war crime. Your "battlefield AI" targets an elementary school: software bug, it happens, can't be helped.

"War Crimes" only apply to the loser of the war and are prosecuted by the victor.

Meaning whatever horrors are done on either side, only the horrors committed by the loser will be "crimes". The inclusion of AI doesn't change that.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#50

Post by breppp »

text0404 wrote: post #43
nomel wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a popular conspiracy theory, without evidence, and without any perspective on any information that intelligence had. Using civilians as shields is well documented/known for Iranian military and groups they sponsor. For example, hospitals [1]. Shitty, but possibly a valid military target. [1] https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/8666/yemen-human-shields

> Gatestone Institute is an American far-right think tank known for publishing anti-Muslim articles. > The organization has attracted attention for publishing false or inaccurate articles, some of which were shared widely. > The Gatestone Institute has been frequently described as anti-Muslim, regularly publishes false reports to stoke anti-Muslim fears, and has published false stories pertaining to Muslims and Islam…

It's more complex than that, you have direct evidence of Iran recruiting 12 year old child soldiers in this war (https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wqgjn7x89o).

Using stadiums as security forces hiding places (https://www.wsj.com/world/middle-east/israel-iran-leadership...)

Misusing hospitals for military purposes (https://www.iranintl.com/en/202602215486) and schools (https://x.com/IranIntl_En/status/2032846253189411146 https://www.instagram.com/p/DV8NUQPFJJv), while the last ones are weak visual evidence and backed up by rumors, Iran is currently under internet blackout for over a month as the regime is interested in controlling information flowing out of the country.

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