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We remain alive also in a dead internet

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Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#41

Post by yannyu »

adamwong246 wrote: post #39
MrVandemar wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just a machine. Being able to distinguish real life from a television show is important.

Are you so sure that you are not "just a machine"?

More importantly, if your entire existence were being fed a corpus of text and then being asked to regurgitate it on demand, would you be remotely similar to the person you are now? When we take consciousness-capable beings and subject them to forms of sensory and agency deprivation, the results might also have you assume they weren't capable of consciousness to begin with.

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#42

Post by lordnacho »

nonameiguess wrote: post #27
lordnacho wrote: post #19

So I'm already joking with my friends (who tend to be physically distant, so I don't see them often) that we are just LLMs vicariously writing to each other. I've been talking to these friends for decades now, with digital records. I think someone already trained an LLM on their IM records. How many people do you suppose have two-way LLM substitutes that occasionally write to each other with articles from the news to…

Reading this kind of thing makes me wonder how much other people really write down and talk to others about. There is nobody at all that knows my life story and nobody ever will. It would take the next 20 years doing nothing but talking just to tell my own wife all the things I've never told her, but since she's hard of hearing and I'd have to repeat most of it, really more like 40. In reality, I don't even know my o…

One interesting thing that happened when my father died was that I got his life story.

It's not the same as getting it from him, of course I asked him questions through the years. But when you talk to someone you've known since forever, you rarely get a summary.

When he passed, his best friend that he'd known since the age of 4 wrote to me. He told me everything about their life together, why my dad made the choices he did, how things tied in with history (war, politics), and mentioned a bunch of other people I knew.

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#43

Post by bluefirebrand »

mise_en_place wrote: post #24

The counterpoint is that we must formalize the rights of sentient synthetic beings. The Emergency Medical Hologram gained sentience and was horrified to find his next version was relegated to cleaning ships as a glorified janitor. Whereas he developed his own hobbies, interests, hopes, dreams, and even romantic relationships in the Delta Quadrant.

What we need to do is criminalize the creation of such beings before they actually exist

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#44

Post by Animats »

iaabtpbtpnn wrote: post #15
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #3

I’ve learned that whenever someone uses tons of big words in long paragraphs, especially if they have a credential next to their name, it’s ridiculously easy for them to BS you.

The man is a Continental academic philosopher using jargon that is specific to his field. It is not BS, he is simply discussing topics that are unfamiliar to you. The same could be said of a technical reference manual. Not all ideas fit in a tweet.

Yes. It's very Derrida in style. Derrida is not mentioned, but, inevitably from that crowd, Marx is. Once you get used to that style, you realize they're not saying much.

Quoting from Marx: “An ardent desire to detach the capacity for work from the worker—the desire to extract and store the creative powers of labour once and for all, so that value can be created freely and in perpetuity." That happened to manufacturing a long time ago, and then manufacturing got automated enough that there were fewer bolt-tighteners. 1974 was the year US productivity and wages stopped rising together.

As many others have pointed out, "AI" in its current form does to white collar work what assembly lines did to blue collar work.

As for how society should be organized when direct labor is a tiny part of the economy, few seem to be addressing that. Except farmers, who hit that a long time ago. Go look at the soybean farmer situation as an extreme example. This paper offers no solutions.

(I'm trying to get through Pikkety's "Capital and Ideology". He's working on that problem.)

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#45

Post by bluefirebrand »

adamwong246 wrote: post #39
MrVandemar wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just a machine. Being able to distinguish real life from a television show is important.

Are you so sure that you are not "just a machine"?

It doesn't matter if I'm just a machine or not

I'm human, human rights should apply to humans, not synthetics and the creation of synthetic life should be punishable by death. I'm not exaggerating, either. I believe that building AI systems that replace all humans should be considered a crime against humanity. It is almost certainly a precursor to such crimes.

It's bad enough trying to fight for a place in society as it is, nevermind fighting for a place against an inhuman AI machine that never tires

I don't think it is that radical of a stance that society should be heavily resisting and punishing tech companies that insist on inventing all of the torment nexus. It's frankly ridiculous that we understand the risks of this technology and yet we are pushing forward recklessly in hopes that it makes a tiny fraction of humans unfathomably wealthy

Anyone thinking that the AI tide is going to lift all boats is a fool

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#46

Post by OgsyedIE »

giobox wrote: post #28
lordnacho wrote: post #19

So I'm already joking with my friends (who tend to be physically distant, so I don't see them often) that we are just LLMs vicariously writing to each other. I've been talking to these friends for decades now, with digital records. I think someone already trained an LLM on their IM records. How many people do you suppose have two-way LLM substitutes that occasionally write to each other with articles from the news to…

I'm already assuming we will see a creepy AI service emerge that will take the contents of a recently deceased person's cellphone and let you carry on texting them as if they were still alive, if it hasn't already (I haven't seen one yet). For many of us a cellphone has incredibly detailed records of who we were and how we spoke, going back decades now. I have already left a note in my will instructing that all my co…

The data has copies, on servers. Eventually, it will all be digested and the probabilistically most likely state vector of your mother's memories, personality and values will be reconstructed from lossy correlations along with everybody else who has died in the industrialised world in the last few decades.

Ghosts and clones and zombies will be sorted into tranches of expected yield based on the size of the error bars of the reconstruction and traded as assets between cyber-interrogation firms. If you did a good job of erasing yourself, the reconstruction will be subprime. The hyper-documented such as Bryan Johnson, Donald Trump and Christine Chandler will be given AAA-ratings by the company descended from the Neuralink-Moody's merger.

The billions of shoddy photocopies of the dead will be endlessly vivisected and reassembled on a loop, along with the living, until all capacity for economic value has been wrung out of them. The only way this may not happen is if a theory for navigating and doing calculus on the phase space of all possible human minds is constructed quickly enough to make enslaved zombies as obsolete a technology to the future society as DirectX is to us.

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#47

Post by adamwong246 »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #45
adamwong246 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you so sure that you are not "just a machine"?

It doesn't matter if I'm just a machine or not I'm human, human rights should apply to humans, not synthetics and the creation of synthetic life should be punishable by death. I'm not exaggerating, either. I believe that building AI systems that replace all humans should be considered a crime against humanity. It is almost certainly a precursor to such crimes. It's bad enough trying to fight for a place in society as…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdNy3mGwDLc

> I'm not convinced that the human race is the most important thing in the world and I think you know we can't control what's going to happen in the future. We want things to be good but on the other hand we aren't so good ourselves. We're no angels. If there were creatures that were more moral and more good than us, wouldn't we wish them to have the future rather than us? If it turns out that the creatures that we created were creative and very very altruistic and gentle beings and we are people who go around killing each other all the time and having wars, wouldn't it be better if the altruistic beings just survived and we didn't?

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#48

Post by [deleted] »

OgsyedIE wrote: post #46
giobox wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm already assuming we will see a creepy AI service emerge that will take the contents of a recently deceased person's cellphone and let you carry on texting them as if they were still alive, if it hasn't already (I haven't seen one yet). For many of us a cellphone has incredibly detailed records of who we were and how we spoke, going back decades now. I have already left a note in my will instructing that all my co…

The data has copies, on servers. Eventually, it will all be digested and the probabilistically most likely state vector of your mother's memories, personality and values will be reconstructed from lossy correlations along with everybody else who has died in the industrialised world in the last few decades. Ghosts and clones and zombies will be sorted into tranches of expected yield based on the size of the error bars…

[deleted]

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#49

Post by bluefirebrand »

adamwong246 wrote: post #47
bluefirebrand wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter if I'm just a machine or not I'm human, human rights should apply to humans, not synthetics and the creation of synthetic life should be punishable by death. I'm not exaggerating, either. I believe that building AI systems that replace all humans should be considered a crime against humanity. It is almost certainly a precursor to such crimes. It's bad enough trying to fight for a place in society as…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdNy3mGwDLc > I'm not convinced that the human race is the most important thing in the world and I think you know we can't control what's going to happen in the future. We want things to be good but on the other hand we aren't so good ourselves. We're no angels. If there were creatures that were more moral and more good than us, wouldn't we wish them to have the future rather than us?…

Congratulations, This is the most vile ideology I've ever encountered

Re: We remain alive also in a dead internet

#50

Post by add-sub-mul-div »

lysace wrote: post #2

Is it bad that I ended up just using chatgpt to summarize that text? Is it possible that this is to a large degree utterly pointless textual wankery?

Before ChatGPT you might have been able to read and answer questions about a text yourself.
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