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Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

wsj.com

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Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#41

Post by Schweigi »

slg wrote: post #25
QuikAccount wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe the data is accurate simply because most crime of this level is not reported because the victims accurately believe nothing will happen.

Do businesses not have insurance? Does this insurance not ask for a police report?

As a smaller business you’re not gonna waste your time to organize a police report if the theft is $100 or $200 dollars. It would cost you more than what you get back. There will also be an insurance deductible so not sure if it will even work at all.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#42

Post by ceejayoz »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #28
ceejayoz wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cops outright make shit up to win political points. For example: https://www.businessinsider.com/nypds-shake-shack-hoax-stop-...

So some cops lied in New York about something unrelated... so they must be lying about well-documented phenomena in Los Angeles over an entirely different issue. Not only that, but they must be somehow incentivized to do so. I don't find that argument convincing.

Oh, LA's cops have bigger issues. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LASD_deputy_gangs

There's a grim and extensive investigation at https://knock-la.com/tradition-of-violence-lasd-gang-history... of this.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#43

Post by toomuchtodo »

the_cat_kittles wrote: post #33
WalterBright wrote: post #7

It's coming to Seattle, too. Thieves smashed several of Nordstrom's windows at $50,000 apiece. Small businesses are simply giving up and leaving. I expect it won't be long before storefronts sprout rollup steel shields that extend from the pavement up and cover the complete storefront. That's what businesses do in Brazil. Amazon is abandoning one of its downtown buildings because the employees don't feel safe there a…

so what do you propose as a solution

Prosecuting petty crime with a (legitimate, funded, and measured effectiveness) diversion path for anyone who isn’t an egregious reoffender.

“Stop! Or I’ll say stop again!” Is not a successful strategy. Three strikes is excessively punitive, but neither does allowing rampant crime to continue unabated.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#44

Post by colpabar »

ceejayoz wrote: post #15
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really 13%, or... A. The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers[1], and B. Most business owners don't bother anymore with reporting, because what's the point? I'd say it's probably a combination of the above. Edit: [1]Because it is an election year. High crime looks bad.

> The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers... ... and cops have an incentive to overstate them.

Do they? More crimes means a lower solved crime rate, which looks reflects poorly on the city's leadership.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#45

Post by slg »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #26
slg wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do businesses not have insurance? Does this insurance not ask for a police report?

Why file an insurance claim for petty theft when there's high insurance premiums in the area? Forget it - the time and effort for paperwork, and reporting, and paying premiums is greater than what you'll recover.

The amount being stolen is high enough to be debilating for businesses but low enough not to justify an insurance claim?

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#46

Post by micromacrofoot »

bcj7393nsk wrote: post #17
micromacrofoot wrote: post #9

wage theft still vastly eclipses all retail theft, yet gets far fewer headlines… ask yourself why whenever you see the retail theft reporting hysteria the people stealing from retail have very likely had more of their labor stolen than they’re lifting (it’s likely true for you too) https://fair.org/home/shoplifting-is-big-news-stealing-milli... https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-bigger-problem-fo...

> wage theft still vastly eclipses all retail theft, yet gets far fewer headlines… ask yourself why whenever you see the retail theft reporting hysteria Try to stop wage theft, get an unproductive conversation, or worse, get fired. Try to stop petty crime, get assaulted, or worse, get killed. There’s a reason no one gives a shit about wage theft: they simply don’t care.

Funny that the companies reporting high volumes of retail theft are the same ones often perpetrating wage theft. CVS, for example, has paid out over $100 million in wage theft settlements.

https://violationtracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent/cvs-health

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#47

Post by micromacrofoot »

giantg2 wrote: post #35
micromacrofoot wrote: post #9

wage theft still vastly eclipses all retail theft, yet gets far fewer headlines… ask yourself why whenever you see the retail theft reporting hysteria the people stealing from retail have very likely had more of their labor stolen than they’re lifting (it’s likely true for you too) https://fair.org/home/shoplifting-is-big-news-stealing-milli... https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-bigger-problem-fo...

"the people stealing from retail have very likely had more of their labor stolen than they’re lifting" I'm skeptical of that. Do you have any info on the demographics and work history of the perpetrators? I'd imagine that many are younger and may not have worked enough to have this be true. Even then, I doubt they're stealing from the company that stole from them, and it doesn't make it right.

CVS alone has paid $100 million in wage theft settlements

https://violationtracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent/cvs-health

A single walgreens theft recently resulted in hundreds of news reports… walgreens’ multi-million wage theft settlement? outrageously less coverage

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#48

Post by sokoloff »

robertlagrant wrote: post #38
sokoloff wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read that as "I'm not going to do my job, because this other group isn't doing their job." I guess any city gets roughly the government they want/deserve/tolerate.

They aren't the government. But if you detect crimes that are not prosecuted, you probably aren't going to get anything out of it, including a criminal brought to justice, so why bother?

The police aren’t part of the government? (They are.)

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#49

Post by ceejayoz »

colpabar wrote: post #44
ceejayoz wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers... ... and cops have an incentive to overstate them.

Do they? More crimes means a lower solved crime rate, which looks reflects poorly on the city's leadership.

Police unions are frequently feuding with city leadership.

As an example, the NYPD doxxed DiBlasio's daughter in revenge for his position on the George Floyd murder: https://www.newsweek.com/nypd-sergeants-benevolent-associati...

Overstating/cherrypicking crimes is a frequently utilized PR tactic to fight attempts at police reform, budget cuts, etc.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#50

Post by marcinzm »

ceejayoz wrote: post #19
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really - as the article says, the cops are discouraged and it's not like there's a bounty per arrest. Overstating the numbers is a waste of time not accomplishing anything if true.

Cops outright make shit up to win political points. For example: https://www.businessinsider.com/nypds-shake-shack-hoax-stop-...

Property crimes generally aren't reported by the police so it's not something the police could fudge. Now arrest rates they may lie about (read: arrest innocent people) to meet quotas.
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