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Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

wsj.com

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Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#11

Post by Finnucane »

throw_m239339 wrote: post #4

> Some former police officials said in interviews that officers don’t feel it is worth making an arrest in low-level cases because they assume the district attorney won’t file charges. They also point to a statewide ballot measure passed in 2014—Proposition 47—that raised the dollar amount at which theft can be prosecuted as a felony from $400 to $950. https://archive.fo/WlnP3

Despite the focus on SF, this is a national issue.

https://www.themarshallproject.org/2017/08/09/what-s-the-pun...

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#13

Post by gjsman-1000 »

slg wrote: post #8

> Property crimes declined in San Francisco during the first year of the pandemic, but rose 13% in 2021. There is an ongoing national narrative about how shoplifting and petty theft has been out of control and yet the numbers rarely back up this narrative. A two year stretch in which the numbers dropped then bounced back up by 13% is not "insane" by any stretch of the imagination.

Is it really 13%, or...

A. The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers[1], and B. Most business owners don't bother anymore with reporting, because what's the point?

I'd say it's probably a combination of the above.

Edit: [1]Because it is an election year. High crime looks bad.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#14

Post by giantg2 »

WalterBright wrote: post #7

It's coming to Seattle, too. Thieves smashed several of Nordstrom's windows at $50,000 apiece. Small businesses are simply giving up and leaving. I expect it won't be long before storefronts sprout rollup steel shields that extend from the pavement up and cover the complete storefront. That's what businesses do in Brazil. Amazon is abandoning one of its downtown buildings because the employees don't feel safe there a…

"Small businesses are simply giving up and leaving."

It's already tough enough dealing with all the tax, regulation, competing with large corporations and the internet etc. I can't imagine wanting to stay in business to deal with multiple burglaries and thefts, with the associated costs of security improvements and insurance premiums.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#15

Post by ceejayoz »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #13
slg wrote: post #8

> Property crimes declined in San Francisco during the first year of the pandemic, but rose 13% in 2021. There is an ongoing national narrative about how shoplifting and petty theft has been out of control and yet the numbers rarely back up this narrative. A two year stretch in which the numbers dropped then bounced back up by 13% is not "insane" by any stretch of the imagination.

Is it really 13%, or... A. The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers[1], and B. Most business owners don't bother anymore with reporting, because what's the point? I'd say it's probably a combination of the above. Edit: [1]Because it is an election year. High crime looks bad.

> The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers...

... and cops have an incentive to overstate them.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#16

Post by QuikAccount »

slg wrote: post #8

> Property crimes declined in San Francisco during the first year of the pandemic, but rose 13% in 2021. There is an ongoing national narrative about how shoplifting and petty theft has been out of control and yet the numbers rarely back up this narrative. A two year stretch in which the numbers dropped then bounced back up by 13% is not "insane" by any stretch of the imagination.

I don't believe the data is accurate simply because most crime of this level is not reported because the victims accurately believe nothing will happen.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#17

Post by bcj7393nsk »

micromacrofoot wrote: post #9

wage theft still vastly eclipses all retail theft, yet gets far fewer headlines… ask yourself why whenever you see the retail theft reporting hysteria the people stealing from retail have very likely had more of their labor stolen than they’re lifting (it’s likely true for you too) https://fair.org/home/shoplifting-is-big-news-stealing-milli... https://www.epi.org/publication/wage-theft-bigger-problem-fo...

> wage theft still vastly eclipses all retail theft, yet gets far fewer headlines… ask yourself why whenever you see the retail theft reporting hysteria

Try to stop wage theft, get an unproductive conversation, or worse, get fired.

Try to stop petty crime, get assaulted, or worse, get killed.

There’s a reason no one gives a shit about wage theft: they simply don’t care.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#18

Post by gjsman-1000 »

ceejayoz wrote: post #15
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really 13%, or... A. The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers[1], and B. Most business owners don't bother anymore with reporting, because what's the point? I'd say it's probably a combination of the above. Edit: [1]Because it is an election year. High crime looks bad.

> The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers... ... and cops have an incentive to overstate them.

Not really - as the article says, the cops are discouraged and it's not like there's a bounty per arrest. Overstating the numbers is a waste of time not accomplishing anything if true.

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#19

Post by ceejayoz »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #18
ceejayoz wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The city has incentive to hide the actual numbers... ... and cops have an incentive to overstate them.

Not really - as the article says, the cops are discouraged and it's not like there's a bounty per arrest. Overstating the numbers is a waste of time not accomplishing anything if true.

Cops outright make shit up to win political points.

For example: https://www.businessinsider.com/nypds-shake-shack-hoax-stop-...

Re: Petty Thieves Plague San Francisco. ‘These Last Two Years Have Been Insane.’

#20

Post by awillen »

slg wrote: post #8

> Property crimes declined in San Francisco during the first year of the pandemic, but rose 13% in 2021. There is an ongoing national narrative about how shoplifting and petty theft has been out of control and yet the numbers rarely back up this narrative. A two year stretch in which the numbers dropped then bounced back up by 13% is not "insane" by any stretch of the imagination.

The numbers are based off what gets reported. Nobody reports anything in San Francisco any more. It's subpar work on the part of the WSJ not to understand that, but when calling the police is a waste of time, the numbers aren't going to reflect reality.
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