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E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

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41–50 of 194 posts

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#41

> They can display a total of 32,000 colors and 200 to 300 PPI, depending on the screen size. I’m going to guess that’s 15-bit colour (32,768 colours) in the form of RGB channels, 5 bits per channel (32 possible values). For full colour imagery, I imagine you’d still want dithering to simulate higher bit depths. 300dpi is fine enough that I believe you could make it very subtle indeed, so that you could well have to…

Wouldn't e-ink be in CMY(K) instead of RGB since it's reflective?

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For that size screen, yes. I think roughly $1-3/screen for that size is good. That’s what a small OLED screen will run you at any kind of volume. For $20 I would want something on the order of 6x8”. For $35 a 20” diagonal panel. Granted you linked to Adafruit which is wonderful for their educational resources and easy to use high quality components, but that’s not where I would source parts for a project unless they…

> For that size screen, yes. I think roughly $1-3/screen for that size is good. That's just unrealistic. Similar LCD screen is also $20: https://www.adafruit.com/product/358 If you negotiate directly with manufacturers, or order direct from china, I'm certain both of these would be much cheaper, but I'm talking about US retail prices and how LCD and E-Ink are very similarly priced at this level. > but that’s not wher…

$20 for the LCD is one component among many that you need to build a hobby project. It adds up quick if you pay retail like that. Meanwhile, if you can reduce that by an order of magnitude, the number of projects that will take advantage of it will increase. As for hobbyist projects vs commercial products, many hobbyists have created businesses from their projects, and that goes from woodworking to baking to electronics. Seems like 6-7 years ago there was a lot of excitement around the idea of "desktop manufacturing" and realizing the promise of 3D printing for small batch electronics. Maybe that was a little early in the hype cycle but I very much would like to see this sort of thing take off. Every $ counts in making that a realistic possibility.

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#43

> They can display a total of 32,000 colors and 200 to 300 PPI, depending on the screen size. I’m going to guess that’s 15-bit colour (32,768 colours) in the form of RGB channels, 5 bits per channel (32 possible values). For full colour imagery, I imagine you’d still want dithering to simulate higher bit depths. 300dpi is fine enough that I believe you could make it very subtle indeed, so that you could well have to…

Each pixel has all eight pigments in it. I'm assuming that is RGB,CMY, Black, and White. It's not clear whether they can mix two or more of those pigments in a single pixel or if they can only switch one fully on and the others off.

It would be nice if they provided some detailed gradient color wheel images on the device.

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#44
post #41

> They can display a total of 32,000 colors and 200 to 300 PPI, depending on the screen size. I’m going to guess that’s 15-bit colour (32,768 colours) in the form of RGB channels, 5 bits per channel (32 possible values). For full colour imagery, I imagine you’d still want dithering to simulate higher bit depths. 300dpi is fine enough that I believe you could make it very subtle indeed, so that you could well have to…

Wouldn't e-ink be in CMY(K) instead of RGB since it's reflective?

No, still RGB. We're not mixing pigments, just using subpixels.

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#45
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I am so against intellectual monopoly like this. It does not create continuous incentive to innovate and instead allows companies with just a bit of innovation to rest on their laurels. I think there would be much more innovation in the world, aka a “higher rate of innovation” without intellectual monopolies and intellectual property restrictions.

Why would you want to innovate when the bigger competitor can just copy you without paying you anything? This current situation is unfortunate, but I think it's an imperfection of the market. If the patent owning company had been a bit less greedy, they could have made far more money with it.

> Why would you want to innovate when the bigger competitor can just copy you without paying you anything?

Because they can't begin to copy you until you've released your product to market, so you have profit potential for being the first mover.

This happens all the time as only a small percentage of the innovation that occurs actually gets patented.

In some cases it would be possible for a big company to take your innovation out from under you but if they can do a better job then we're all better off for that. If as an inventor you've only got one idea, you're screwed. You need to be able to innovate repeatedly.

But the concise way of responding to this is: markets already reward innovation. We do not need state controls on information to "stimulate innovation". The incentive exists as a natural effect of markets.

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#46
post #24

The picture presented has 133134 colors in it from my very rough calculation. That is not at all how the display will look.

I agree with the conclusion but how did you do your calculation? If you take a picture of a 16 colors screen you will find many more colors in that picture (main reason being that pixels won't align perfectly).

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes because the only thing better than a medium sized company that won’t license its patents is a megacorp that won’t license its patents /s No the solution is to incentivize patent licensing and in the case of software make it simply not patentable. The corporate overlords won’t save us from themselves. If they had their way patents would simply never expire.

A megacorp sitting on some patents can and will still release a whole range of mass market products (large volumes, so has to be cheap) that uses those patents and makes it available to the masses. A medium sized company can't really do that, so at best they will release a niche product that makes it available to a few people.

MegaCorp (like say Amazon) would lock the tech up so only their products have it, So instead of being able to pick from a Kindle PaperWhite, OnyxBook, and a Remarkable you would only have the Kindle... and varitions of the Kindle

Medium Corp will license their patent (at extreme rates) to other companies MegaCorp will not.

Medium Corp is better than MegaCorp for consumers most of the time. FRAND licensing even batter, and No Patents at all even better

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#48
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too bad one of the megacaps hasn’t bought them out.

Yes because the only thing better than a medium sized company that won’t license its patents is a megacorp that won’t license its patents /s No the solution is to incentivize patent licensing and in the case of software make it simply not patentable. The corporate overlords won’t save us from themselves. If they had their way patents would simply never expire.

Your first sentence, but unironically.

Big corp probably isn't as devoted to milking one IP asset to the detriment of its adoption. And they may have the resources to make more products in-house that utilize the tech.

I agree that the patent system needs modification in the long run, though.

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don’t forget 3D printing that also only really started when patents expired.

Between 2007-2009, 80+ Stratasys patents expired. Think about this - a single company holding back the world in advancing forward in 3D printing. Orthogonally, ever wondered why memory on your PC is so expensive? Thanks to Micron, Hynix and Samsung triopoly.

But isn’t it those same companies that are the reason that memory isn’t $1000/megabyte?

Re: E Ink has developed a 2nd generation Advanced Color E-Paper

#50
post #4

I've heard people argue that e-ink displays would be in much wider use if the patent-holding company weren't so protective of the technology. So the news I'm waiting to hear is when E-Ink the company decides to loosen up its business practices.

If the patent holding company hadn’t bothered, e-ink would barely exist though.
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