Von Braun Class Station • Hacker News Board

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#41

Post by Thrymr » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 1:46 AM UTC

frostburg wrote: post #24

firefix wrote: post #21

Man. Von Braun? That’s not someone to name anything after. Please read Operation Paperclip by Annie Jacobsen. What Von Braun did was beyond horrible so much so to make the death camps look less bad in comparison, which is really saying something. They plowed through people making them death march then dig huge underground missile factories with their bare hands, then had them make missiles to kill their families and…

Among other things, it must be said that each V2 was completely useless to the war effort and cost as much as several tanks. They didn't even tie up anti-air resources because it was impossible to intercept one.

It also took ~30,000 potatoes to make the alcohol fuel for each rocket, while German food supplies were running low during the last winter of the war [0].

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V-2_rocket

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#42

Post by stevespang » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 1:55 AM UTC

Hey, all that's missing in the deal is a crypto offering [sic] . . .

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#43

Post by aetherson » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:09 AM UTC

codesnik wrote: post #19

nullifidian wrote: post #14

This video by Columbia based researchers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3D7QlMVa5s says that Coriolis acceleration induced canal sickness could be a major issue, and we don't know exactly what humans can tolerate. In the worst case scenario such torus has to be about one kilometer in diameter, which is prohibitively expensive.

I once made napkin calculations that for 1g "gravitation" a station even about 50 meters in diameter would introduce coriolis force so great you'll have a lot of trouble even trying to stand up from a chair.

Nobody knows what effects long-term exposure to low, but not zero, gravity will have, but assuming that it is substantially better than microgravity, stations with rotational gravity of somewhere in the 1-5m/s2 seem like they may offer benefits with substantially lower engineering challenges.

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#44

Post by AndrewBissell » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:21 AM UTC

bigbubba wrote: post #16

ahelwer wrote: post #3

Maybe we should stop naming things after a man who was not only a nazi, but a uniform-wearing member of the SS? A future-looking project should leave such things in the past.

Once ze rockets go up, who cares where they come down? Zat's not my department, says Werner Von Braun.

For those who don't know, this is from a very cutting song by Tom Lehrer: https://youtu.be/TjDEsGZLbio

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#45

Post by rsynnott » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:24 AM UTC

fastball wrote: post #12

trhway wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> zero attention to his ideals and life legacy. the one's ideals and legacy are worth less than nothing if it is built, with the one's full awareness and willful participation, by concentration camp slaves dying in droves from malnutrition, physical abuse and the hard labor while building those ideals and legacy. > employer of the time that defense line of "i was just carrying out the orders" was explicitly addressed…

I didn't realize that concentration camp victims were building rockets?

The Nazis used slave labour very extensively; it’s probably safe to assume that it was involved in most of their industrial production. In this particular case, though, it was extensive, well documented, and extremely nasty.

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#46

Post by nradov » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:25 AM UTC

aetherson wrote: post #43

codesnik wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I once made napkin calculations that for 1g "gravitation" a station even about 50 meters in diameter would introduce coriolis force so great you'll have a lot of trouble even trying to stand up from a chair.

Nobody knows what effects long-term exposure to low, but not zero, gravity will have, but assuming that it is substantially better than microgravity, stations with rotational gravity of somewhere in the 1-5m/s2 seem like they may offer benefits with substantially lower engineering challenges.

Right let's start with 0.1G as a proof of concept and then build larger, faster rotating habitats later.

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#47

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:26 AM UTC

bigbubba wrote: post #16

ahelwer wrote: post #3

Maybe we should stop naming things after a man who was not only a nazi, but a uniform-wearing member of the SS? A future-looking project should leave such things in the past.

Once ze rockets go up, who cares where they come down? Zat's not my department, says Werner Von Braun.

[deleted]

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#48

Post by rsynnott » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:30 AM UTC

rbanffy wrote: post #25

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of better names are available: "Originally proposed by Konstantin Tsiolkovsky in 1903, the idea was expanded by Herman Potočnik in 1929."

It's telling that between a nazi and a communist, some people would choose the nazi.

Tsiolkovsky lived in the Soviet Union, where he worked as a maths teacher. Von Braun was a member of the Nazi party and SS who made weapons with an enormous slave labour force; by some estimates more people died making the things than were killed by them.

Personally, I’d probably go for the maths teacher, when it comes to naming stuff.

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#49

Post by lreeves » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:31 AM UTC

paranoidrobot wrote: post #31

Warning: the video on their site contains completely unnecessary and pointless stock images of severe medical conditions that are quite shocking. I stopped and bailed after the first few images. Whatever they're trying to encourage support for, they've completely lost it as far as I'm concerned.

It is weird to show but unless I missed something it seems like it's just severe water retention in the legs and a back rash, I don't think those are shocking but maybe I have an iron stomach.

Re: Von Braun Class Station

#50

Post by rsynnott » Thu, Dec 17, 2020, 2:32 AM UTC

gnarbarian wrote: post #37

rbanffy wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I prefer people who don't employ genocide victims as slaves for building weapons of mass destruction, but that's me.

If that's your actual beef, Forced Labor Camps/ Gulags were far more heavily used by the Soviet Union than by the Nazis. They were also used to produce weapons. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulag#Economic_role

“Far more heavily used” is incorrect (particularly in Tsiolkovsky‘s time; they became a big deal a bit later), but yes, the gulags existed. Tsiolkovsky wasn’t personally involved with them, though (he was a maths teacher).