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Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

artsy.net

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Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#41

Post by fdloo3 »

throwaway434234 wrote: post #5

You see this in India at every temple that was raided by Muslims. The logic being that breaking the nose would make the "idol" unfit for worship. There probably are a lot of examples in the North (they are now part of some "secular" Mosque complex), but it's very apparent in some of the Hoysala temples that were partially/fully destroyed (esp. Halebidu), and in Vijayanagara. It's really quite sad. Then again, I suppo…

Well the other side of the coin is, Indian civilization survives. The same language, rituals, stories, music, food, imagery used, are all pretty much alive outside and inside thousands of temple even today. Those aspects of culture have somehow weathered invasion, natural disasters, famine, and drought. You can't say the same about Egyptian civilization.

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#42

Post by EGreg »

725686 wrote: post #37
EGreg wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Literally hear? Citation needed!

The citation is the very first thing in the comment you responded to: The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind by Julian Jaynes. Haven't read it but heard of it many times. Interesting speculation, but there you have your citation.

You haven’t read it but you know egyptians could literally hear voices from statues? I call exaggeration :)

EDIT: I didn’t see your colon, I thought it was a period which made it sound like you were making the claim yourself, and I was eager to get resources other than his theory, only to hear his theory again lol.

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#43

Post by acron0 »

fwip wrote: post #32

I'm surprised that the article didn't mention another popular theory: that many of the Egyptian statues taken by Europeans had their noses deliberately broken to obscure their blackness. As the theory goes, in order to make the statues seem like high art, it was necessary to make the culture seem more like the ancient Greeks and Romans. Removing their noses made it so the viewer could more easily read the statues as…

Probably because it's not a theory with any substantial evidence.

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#44

Post by aaaaaaaaaaab »

fwip wrote: post #32

I'm surprised that the article didn't mention another popular theory: that many of the Egyptian statues taken by Europeans had their noses deliberately broken to obscure their blackness. As the theory goes, in order to make the statues seem like high art, it was necessary to make the culture seem more like the ancient Greeks and Romans. Removing their noses made it so the viewer could more easily read the statues as…

Yeah, and they didn't mention other crackpot theories either, like ancient aliens destroying the statue's faces with zero-point energy weapons.

I wonder why?

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#45

Post by dalbasal »

LeanderK wrote: post #36
dalbasal wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We kind of don't have a word for "art" either. Historically/etymologically, art means "skilled work" or just "stuff made by people" (as in artifact). The word/concept seems to have evolved gradually to its current meaning with all its complex connotations of beauty, metaphorical depth and existing for its own sake. Even early modern and Renaissance art was probably seen differently to how we see it. A lot of the best…

I don't think this is an valid argument. I think that "art", as understood now, is pretty much the word for "art". A language is an evolving thing and the usage defines the meaning. Many words change their meaning and new words emerge. > Even early modern and Renaissance art was probably seen differently to how we see it. A lot of the best statues and paintings had religious purposes, kind of like Egyptians. Nearly e…

I would be surprised if it was entirely absent in Egypt too.

I didn't mean to imply renaissance people had no concept of art, just that the concept (not just word) was likely somewhat different to ours, which has evolved since.

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#46

Post by danans »

fwip wrote: post #32

I'm surprised that the article didn't mention another popular theory: that many of the Egyptian statues taken by Europeans had their noses deliberately broken to obscure their blackness. As the theory goes, in order to make the statues seem like high art, it was necessary to make the culture seem more like the ancient Greeks and Romans. Removing their noses made it so the viewer could more easily read the statues as…

This theory doesn't hold up not the least because the surviving representations of noses in statuary don't look particularly "black" (interpreted very narrowly as the west sub-saharan facial phenotype), which is the image of Africans around which most Eurocentric racism is built.

Look the statue in the article with an intact nose, and also the statues of the seated pharoahs at Abu Simbel. To my eyes, they just look a lot like egyptian people today, stylized for artistic purposes.

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#48

Post by deadmik3 »

fwip wrote: post #32

I'm surprised that the article didn't mention another popular theory: that many of the Egyptian statues taken by Europeans had their noses deliberately broken to obscure their blackness. As the theory goes, in order to make the statues seem like high art, it was necessary to make the culture seem more like the ancient Greeks and Romans. Removing their noses made it so the viewer could more easily read the statues as…

WE

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#49

Post by malvosenior »

NelsonMinar wrote: post #40

The computer geniuses here at Hacker News have decided the main argument of this article are wrong. But among archaeologists ritual defacement is understood to be a regular thing that happens to art all over the world. Roman coins defaced: https://www.coinsweekly.com/en/Defacing-the-past-damnation-a... Teotihuacan icons demolished and destroyed by fire: https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2017/sep/24/teotihu...

Isn't the argument in the article not that they were defaced due to "ritual defacement" but that vandals thought that by breaking the noses off, they were effectively killing the person in the after life, thus not allowing them to seek retribution for robbing their grave?

Re: Why Do So Many Egyptian Statues Have Broken Noses?

#50

Post by altern8 »

fwip wrote: post #32

I'm surprised that the article didn't mention another popular theory: that many of the Egyptian statues taken by Europeans had their noses deliberately broken to obscure their blackness. As the theory goes, in order to make the statues seem like high art, it was necessary to make the culture seem more like the ancient Greeks and Romans. Removing their noses made it so the viewer could more easily read the statues as…

> [...] rather than the "primitive" countries of black people that Europe was busy exploiting.

I smell a gender studies degree!

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