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What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

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Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#41

Post by adrianN »

_pmf_ wrote: post #26
Animats wrote: post #9

Yeah, hyperloops. Going to be insanely cheap. Right. The one route that might have made sense, Dubai to Abu Dhabi, seems to not be happening. That was over empty flat desert, and had government support, so it might have been built. Monorails are a working technology, but still niche. China has 140Km or so. Japan has about 80Km. They're useful when you have to cram a transit system into a built-up city. The switch pro…

The problem with billionaires guessing what lowly commuters want is that they focus on speed and comfort instead of the more mundane issues as "bum with distinct urine smell", "person who ate several garlic cloves the evening before" and "menacing group of youths".

The problems you point out can't be solved by more money for public transit, and are not what people in countries with better public transit than the US complain about.

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#42

Post by agurk »

> The word is a portemanteau of the English “Gadget” and the German word “bahn”, which means rail or train.

To nitpick bahn[0] can refer to these concepts, but actually has a wider meaning. The most well known of these is of course the Autobahn.

I've always taken it to be closer to the British English word 'way' as used in railway, motorway and right-of-way.

Perhaps Gadgetway would be a more consistent term, or even Gerätbahn if we're going for a full loanword.

[0] https://www.dict.cc/?s=bahn

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#43

Post by kalleboo »

Quequau wrote: post #36

The town I live in is too small for an U-Bahn. Nevertheless it's obvious to anyone paying attention that on-street parking, commuting, and delivery are creating impediments to our happiness and well being. I have often wondered what a delivery U-Bahn might look like... something that was devoted entirely on deliveries of materials and packages. Anything to get more of the cars and trucks off the streets and devote mo…

London used to have a subway dedicated to mail https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Post_Office_Railway

Chicago too https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Tunnel_Company

Many cities including New York had pneumatic tube mail systems https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumatic_tube_mail_in_New_Yor... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumatic_tube#In_postal_servi...

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#44

Post by Moru »

sideshowb wrote: post #37
_pmf_ wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with billionaires guessing what lowly commuters want is that they focus on speed and comfort instead of the more mundane issues as "bum with distinct urine smell", "person who ate several garlic cloves the evening before" and "menacing group of youths".

Also affordability for those on minimum wage.

A train ride cannot be more expencive than the car, then the car will be used.

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#45

Post by pjc50 »

Some other examples include the Bruno Latour classic report on the French "Aramis" system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aramis,_or_the_Love_of_Technol...

"Guided buses" seem to be in the same category. Edinburgh had some which were replaced by conventional trams at great cost. Cambridge has some which has endemic problems: https://www.smartertransport.uk/guided-busway-defects/

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#46

Post by sigi45 »

We need proper Biohazard filters in our trains. Thats way more important and actually relevant than those Gadgetbahns and no one is talking about it :(.

I'm more sick than collegues using there cars and bikes. That is really expensive.

And there might be a moment in time where it is not a cold virus.

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#47

Post by adrianN »

sigi45 wrote: post #46

We need proper Biohazard filters in our trains. Thats way more important and actually relevant than those Gadgetbahns and no one is talking about it :(. I'm more sick than collegues using there cars and bikes. That is really expensive. And there might be a moment in time where it is not a cold virus.

No one is talking about it because you can't prevent infections from spreading in crowded environments.

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#48

Post by mbreese »

mulmen wrote: post #14
wjjdjw wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look at the operational emissions, this is true. Infrastructure does however play a role. Planes have high operational emissions but require little infrastructure. Trains have little emissions but require enormous infrastructure. It's however completely unclear to me which CO2-calculators account the infrastructure, and which do not.

Where does the CO2 cost of the infrastructure come in? Is that just in construction or do rails somehow emit CO2? Or are you just saying that rails take up space and that's an environmental impact too? I feel like I'm missing something.

I’m guessing it is in the production and transportation of materials to the site. Subway stations require a lot of material to build, so you’d have the CO2 cost of the concrete, rebar, etc... rail lines don’t have much material, but producing steel does take a lot of energy. And if the line is between large metro areas, the rails would need to be transported to (potentially) remote areas.

But I’m guessing that in terms of CO2 impact, these are fixed costs. So, it would seem reasonable to me to assume the operating CO2 costs would dramatically outpace the fixed initial costs, hence why it would be ignored.

Or potentially, when comparing two systems, the initial building/infrastructure CO2 costs may be assumed to be roughly equal, so are factored out.

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#49

Post by sigi45 »

adrianN wrote: post #47
sigi45 wrote: post #46

We need proper Biohazard filters in our trains. Thats way more important and actually relevant than those Gadgetbahns and no one is talking about it :(. I'm more sick than collegues using there cars and bikes. That is really expensive. And there might be a moment in time where it is not a cold virus.

No one is talking about it because you can't prevent infections from spreading in crowded environments.

So there is no advantage at all having some filter on top of the train, pushing the air from top or bottom to the other direction?

I would assume that those droplet infections should become less.

Re: What’s a Gadgetbahn? (2017)

#50

Post by C1sc0cat »

lmm wrote: post #39
C1sc0cat wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From a UK perspective (commuting to London 60+ miles each way) speed and comfort are an issue. See the "new" trains by Siemens on the Bedford - Brighton line which have worse comfort and reliability that the older electro stars.

Do the trains actually have comfort or reliability problems, or do people just assume they must? The seats look incredibly thin, but are actually much more comfortable than the ones they replaced IME. Early days saw a lot of train cancellations but that was due to not having enough trained drivers rather than any technical issues.

Not from my experience the elctrostars where much more comfortable for longer > 20 min commutes and there are no power points and no tables at all in standard.
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