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How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

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Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#41

Post by masklinn »

edpichler wrote: post #34

At least it's no so expensive.

* IDEA was 200 + 99/year, new license is 149/year (more expensive from year 3)

* PyCharm, RubyMine, PhpStorm, AppCode and CLion were 99 + 59/year, new license is 99/year (more expensive from year 2)

* WebStorm was 49 + 29/year, new license is 99/year (more expensive from year 1)

Things have gotten significantly more expensive across the board, and if you don't need the new version or can't pay for it… you lose your IDE.

The new licenses are absolutely terrible for holders of individual licenses.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#42

Post by teacup50 »

mkozlows wrote: post #40

I think the critics are missing one huge benefit: Most of their licenses are bought by companies. A company that buys a perpetual license now has no reason to upgrade unless the developers complain and prod; a company that buys a SaaS subscription enables its devs to upgrade to the newest versions as quickly as they want. For most of JetBrains actual corporate users, the upshot of this is that they'll never need to b…

As an owner of a company, business continuity-destroying dependencies on SaaS is the opposite of a big win.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#43

Post by bdarnell »

kuyfiuyg wrote: post #4

Is there any good Java IDE for emacs?

Last time I touched java (a year ago), malabar-mode (https://github.com/m0smith/malabar-mode) was the most feature-rich environment for doing java in emacs. However, it couldn't cope with the complex build system for the project I was working on, so I ended up using intellij instead (if malabar-mode had worked for this project I would have preferred to stay in emacs).

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#44

Post by LoneWolf »

amyjess wrote: post #31
venomsnake wrote: post #7

So once again the people getting the best deal will be the pirates :( I suppose that we are at JetBrains market saturation levels - everybody is using their IDEs, so they just don't sell as many new licences to fuel growth.

> everybody is using their IDEs And I think that's a shame, because I prefer NetBeans over IntelliJ. I've used both, and IntelliJ's Maven integration is just terrible.

Please elaborate, I havent used Netbeans for a while but it really sucked compared even to eclipse. Also never had any problems with maven integration on IntelliJ.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#45

Post by mkozlows »

oneJob wrote: post #17

It's my personal opinion that one only gets complaining rights if one doesn't use Gmail, one doesn't subscribe to NetFlix, one doesn't use Spotify, ad nauseum. JetBrains is making a business decision. That's what businesses do. Their current Community Edition is open-source. Anyone is free to pick up where they left off. That is an enormous contribution they've already made to the community. You make your consumer de…

The more immediately obvious comparison is MSDN. Anyone who's using ReSharper, at least, is already almost certainly subscribing to MSDN.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#46

Post by sfteus »

microtonal wrote: post #30
oneJob wrote: post #17

It's my personal opinion that one only gets complaining rights if one doesn't use Gmail, one doesn't subscribe to NetFlix, one doesn't use Spotify, ad nauseum. JetBrains is making a business decision. That's what businesses do. Their current Community Edition is open-source. Anyone is free to pick up where they left off. That is an enormous contribution they've already made to the community. You make your consumer de…

It's my personal opinion that one only gets complaining rights if one doesn't use Gmail, one doesn't subscribe to NetFlix, one doesn't use Spotify, ad nauseum. That does not make sense. Spotify et al. were like that from the beginning. You know what kind of deal you are getting. JetBrains is changing the rules of the game completely, with very little heads-up time, for people who might be deeply invested in their pro…

On top of that, it's the difference between monthly costs for the company. Netflix, Spotify and Gmail all have monthly costs in terms of storage space, bandwidth usage, server maintenance, etc that users are directly affecting. You're paying for the content to always be available, to be available quickly and to not have limits on what you can and can't access.

Desktop software on the other hand has no direct monthly costs other than phoning home once a month. You could definitely argue that iterating development costs should be factored in here, I can't imagine that being a deciding factor in moving completely to this business model. I'm sure if they offered a low cost monthly subscription and a perpetual license option, they wouldn't have any issue offsetting development costs. At this point, they could even raise the price of perpetual license (hell, I seem to remember paying $200 for mine). I'd gladly pay an increased price with the knowledge that my software wouldn't stop working, especially given how many hours of productivity I gain by using their software.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#47

Post by navait »

jasode wrote: post #6

>, and most customers upgraded every year. Is this statement actually true? Is it educated guessing or has it been substantiated by JetBrains? (Not trying to argue. Just want to know substantiated facts.)

The article is full of unsubstantiated claims, though I agree with the author in principle.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#48

Post by svisser »

oneJob wrote: post #17

It's my personal opinion that one only gets complaining rights if one doesn't use Gmail, one doesn't subscribe to NetFlix, one doesn't use Spotify, ad nauseum. JetBrains is making a business decision. That's what businesses do. Their current Community Edition is open-source. Anyone is free to pick up where they left off. That is an enormous contribution they've already made to the community. You make your consumer de…

> I personally don't agree with their decision. But, I'm not running their business or working their jobs.

What if you discover many other customers also don't agree with this decision?

In that case it seems fair to write it down and provide feedback to the company making the decision.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#49

Post by epalmer »

atonse wrote: post #36
microtonal wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's my personal opinion that one only gets complaining rights if one doesn't use Gmail, one doesn't subscribe to NetFlix, one doesn't use Spotify, ad nauseum. That does not make sense. Spotify et al. were like that from the beginning. You know what kind of deal you are getting. JetBrains is changing the rules of the game completely, with very little heads-up time, for people who might be deeply invested in their pro…

Not so sure about that. JetBrains has excellent products. So, sure, people can flock to other tools, but they aren't necessarily better tools. I have gotten so used to using ReSharper, I'm probably 30% less productive without it.

I use IntelliJ, phpStorm and pyCharm all on a regular business. But I work for a university and just assume that the subscriptions won't lapse. That may be a bad assumption given that I control the departments budget and it would come out of my allocations if the cost go up. Mixed feelings on this change. But I really like the three products I use and will continue to use them.

Re: How JetBrains Lost Years of Customer Loyalty in Just a Few Hours

#50

Post by mariusmg »

atonse wrote: post #36
microtonal wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's my personal opinion that one only gets complaining rights if one doesn't use Gmail, one doesn't subscribe to NetFlix, one doesn't use Spotify, ad nauseum. That does not make sense. Spotify et al. were like that from the beginning. You know what kind of deal you are getting. JetBrains is changing the rules of the game completely, with very little heads-up time, for people who might be deeply invested in their pro…

Not so sure about that. JetBrains has excellent products. So, sure, people can flock to other tools, but they aren't necessarily better tools. I have gotten so used to using ReSharper, I'm probably 30% less productive without it.

I wonder how you actually got to that % number.....
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