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Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

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Re: Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

#391

Post by toyg »

arp242 wrote: post #360
toyg wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no "right to repair" without the 4 freedoms. You can't "repair" if you cannot inspect and run (0 and 1), and your repair is fundamentally meaningless if you cannot communicate it (2 and 3).

> your repair is fundamentally meaningless if you cannot communicate it (2 and 3). I have spent significant amount of time working around bugs and limitations in proprietary software that could have been fixed easily otherwise, and simply being able to fix it for myself or our company would absolutely be beneficial. This is so staggeringly blindly obvious that it pains me that this is even a point of contention. Of c…

> simply being able to fix it for myself or our company would absolutely be beneficial.

That's basically the old Unix model, in practice it was unsatisfactory to the point that... people just wrote their own Unix and made a point that fixes should be public - and we got GNU.

Companies could give you the old Unix model tomorrow, if they so wished; but it's effectively lose-lose, because they don't gain anything meaningful (if anything, their support costs are increased by having to deal with thousands of potential user-introduced variations) and you don't gain anything meaningful either - your fix is forgotten the minute you move on and you won't be able to use it with your next employer.

Re: Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

#392

Post by Levitz »

smt88 wrote: post #375
Dalewyn wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Human rights are not political unless you're trying to reduce them. Mozilla justifiably did not want to work with someone who opposes certain human rights (including those of other employees), and that shouldn't be controversial or political.

What do human rights have to do with any of this? Isn't this about trademarks?

Re: Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

#393

Post by pxc »

tpoacher wrote: post #387

One thing I always find interesting / amusing is how the timing of certain types of post here on HN is in a sense far more informative (e.g. by implication as to "what is the current zeitgeist that has suddenly made this "news" or relevant again?), than the linked articles themselves. E.g. crablang wasn't exactly announced yesterday for this to be newsworthy in itself; but an HN top post on crablang almost serves as…

It was posted in the comments to the 'Why I'm leaving Rust'¹ post that made it to the front page two days ago. At that point it was predictable that Crab would make it to the front page in a day or two.

Comments with links on front page items tend to turn into successful submissions within a day or two like that. Or rather, a fair number of front page items at any time turn out to have been preceded that way.

--

1: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36101501

Re: Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

#394

Post by pie_flavor »

cookieperson wrote: post #190
saithound wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an interested outsider, it is indeed painfully clear at this point that someone is behaving like an asshole and damaging the project. Creating a hostile fork ticks both boxes.

If the people in charge don't represent you, and you can't get rid of them, do your own thing. I see nothing wrong with this. It's an OSS project, people can do what they want with it. I doubt it'll succeed but who cares people can do whatever they want. I'm honestly surprised at the amount of people on here taking the side of "take the abuse from leadership and don't do what you want with OSS".

They're not doing their own thing. They're doing the same thing with a different name and have no intent to contribute original patches that don't change the name. It takes about two seconds in GitHub's UI to fork, and about five minutes of fiddling with sed to change it to the degree that they changed it.

Re: Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

#395

Post by pie_flavor »

interlinked wrote: post #238
saithound wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an interested outsider, it is indeed painfully clear at this point that someone is behaving like an asshole and damaging the project. Creating a hostile fork ticks both boxes.

This fork is and will always be 'ctrl+c','ctrl+v' of the rust language. The only difference is that the owners of this fork will not go after your business if you abuse their trademark. The presence of this fork means that rust foundation cannot enforce their trademark anymore. The day they try to, it will become a headline and all the businesses will start using this fork whenever they want to talk about rust langua…

Talking about the language is something the trademark policy clearly says you can do. Everything that is a trademark violation under the policy is something that's really obviously a trademark violation for pretty much everyone, which businesses do not do very frequently.

Re: Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

#396

Post by slashdev »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #359
weinzierl wrote: post #55

I disagree with the general sentiment in this thread that this is a useless immature move. Sure, Crab will almost certainly not replace Rust, but that is not the goal. The ultimate objective is to influence Rust stakeholders' decisions. This is similar to a strike where ultimately your goal is not to destroy the company or to quit and leave, but to achieve better conditions. In both cases it sometimes works and somet…

> Sure, Crab will almost certainly not replace Rust, but that is not the goal. I see it as: there's a finite amount of people who choose to dedicate their unpaid free time contributing to making Rust better (working on fixing bugs, new features, etc.) This seems like fragmentation which basically will slow down progress. Now, obviously the people who choose to dedicate their free time to open source software are enti…

On the other hand it could become a place to test ideas and port the winners over to rust. It’s not necessarily negative.

Re: Rust has been forked to the Crab Language

#397

Post by pie_flavor »

silisili wrote: post #20
dmeijboom wrote: post #14

This happened a while ago and was related to the trademark/copyright issue. It’s an immature move and I can’t take this seriously. All this does is creating unnecessary drama surrounding the Rust foundation.

> All this does is creating unnecessary drama surrounding the Rust foundation. They are doing a fantastic job of creating drama all by themselves. I don't use Rust, but the constant childish bickering has turned me away from even caring to.

You can find no trace of childish bickering in the language, tools, libraries, or documentation. I'm not sure why people doing silly things off in the distance would bias you against using Rust, the use of which would not involve those people ever.
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