Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs • Hacker News Board

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#391

Post by Brian_K_White » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 1:10 PM UTC

iopq wrote: post #279

golem14 wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see nothing wrong with this. Most people are hardwired to be helpful to others, especially when no one else is judging.

If you ask a question usually few, if any, people attempt to help. When you outright say something wrong, everyone will be telling you the exact solution to your problem

This.

Some people do it out of generosity, but for some it's a special subset of passive-aggression, a way to say you're wrong and I'm better, but indirectly and deniably.

I'm pretty sure I do it for both reasons at different times and in different cases.

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#392

Post by verinus » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 1:11 PM UTC

dgb23 wrote: post #252

niccl wrote: post #225

These comments seem to make a gloriously meta confirmation of the article's point. The article is saying that engineers (among others) have been known to optimise for the wrong thing. He uses a possibly inappropriate example of faster dishwashers. Then many of the commenters (quite likely engineers) optimise their comments on the thing they know about -- desirability or otherwise of faster dishwashers -- rather than…

Before I got a job as a developer, which happened by chance because someone noticed that I was a hobbyist programmer, I actually worked as a kitchen help. A large chunk of that was cleaning and dishwashing. Let me tell you that if I didn’t have a very fast dishwasher, I couldn’t do my job well. I was already juggling the time between supporting the cooks, keeping stuff clean and the dishwasher going. I used a fast an…

Well I read you comment in a way that you did not fully grasp what OP intended to say. Why people get so hung up on the speed thing? Yes there are situations where speed is of the essence, but for a private household it is not (statistically speaking in ~95% of the use-cases).

And if I read op in good faith he never ever talks about dishwashers in a professional settings as there apply completely different rules...

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#393

Post by verinus » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 1:14 PM UTC

bborud wrote: post #369

goldcd wrote: post #96

Most people probably don't need a faster dishwasher - but it's a handy feature to have to sell dishwashers. "Cleans just as well, using the same water & power, in half the time?" - well that sounds like you've just created a premium dishwasher you can sell to people who want to own a premium dishwasher. I think it's much the same with all the wifi-enabled, app controlled appliances. Their purpose isn't to be sold as…

It depends on what "faster" means. My dishwasher takes about an hour. If it took 50 or even 40 minutes, that wouldn't change things materially. But if it took 10-15 minutes, it would change the way I plan and execute work in the kitchen quite a bit.

well if I tell you that here in Austria dishwashers, washing machines and dryers (some of most energy hungry systems in a household) get a separate input that allows them to run when lot's of cheap energy (read solar power) is available - that might change again :)

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#394

Post by krageon » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 1:16 PM UTC

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #284

krageon wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need to rinse off what you put in if there is a lot of stuff on it, not because it will not be cleaned (it probably will) but because you don't want to have to clean that out of the machine at the end of the night. What does it mean for the gut barrier to be destroyed? I've worked in such kitchens in the past and there wasn't any material change in how I digest food or how sick I get, so I would suspect it's not…

Well I guess if you're not affected it can't be an issue, can it. Also those asians should simply try milk. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S009167492...

This isn't very nuanced at all - my only point was that it's not as absolute as it sounds when someone says "eating off these plates destroys your gut lining", not that there was nothing to be found at all.

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#395

Post by verinus » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 1:22 PM UTC

bradleyjg wrote: post #109

thiht wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you want me to say my dishes are dirty since they banned phosphate? It's not the case. Honestly the fact phosphates are banned even in the US shows the impact they have, given the crap this country doesn't ban, including in food products. Maybe if CRTs had had a major impact on local water quality they would have been banned too (and I sure hope so)

Sure. Acknowledge that the new dishwashers (washing machines / stoves / toilets / grocery bags / etc.) suck but we need to save the planet. Then show me the evidence they we are actually saving the planet and not just peacocking. I’ll be there with you. Don’t try to tell that we live in a perfect world where there are no tradeoffs and those that I’m seeing are just in my head.

they work just fine. Less energy, water and chemical consumption is always a welcome effect.

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#396

Post by verinus » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 1:26 PM UTC

rpmisms wrote: post #257

Except that if a dishwasher was significantly faster, people would love it. 20 minutes would be enough to make people go "wow, that's really nice", and that would become the new "cool" dishwasher.

even image one that does not require water, electricity or chemicals! ;)

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#397

Post by Ekaros » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 1:47 PM UTC

Blackthorn wrote: post #239

pottertheotter wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found this to be bad advice. I switched to the basic powder stuff for a while and my dishes were always horrible. Went back to Cascade Platinum pods and I've never had a problem.

As America's Test Kitchen said a very long time ago, use the pods that have as many different colors as you can find. Those Cascade Platinum pods are great.

I just go with most expensive and most marketing filled one. It is not that much more expensive for me and I usually try to wash dishes with really dried food. So it works well enough for most of them.

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#398

Post by jonnycomputer » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 2:11 PM UTC

yetihehe wrote: post #64

jonnycomputer wrote: post #37

Most of the comments here are basically explaining why they actually would like faster dishwashers. Choose your motivating examples carefully.

It doesn't matter how carefully you chose your examples, internet is so big that exceptions will happen and people like to voice their contrarian opinions (nothing wrong with that).

Actually, no. Because you see, we have many discussions here on HN where a substantive post doesn't get sidetracked by it. The article isn't even about dishwashers!

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#399

Post by patrickwalton » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 2:14 PM UTC

RangerScience wrote: post #156

> In the same way, people don’t buy a dishwasher, they buy clean dishes before their next meal. Ironically, this tells me some... awkward things about how the author relates to their kitchen. I cook - a lot. I host parties - usually dinner parties - and I use cheap Ikea plates & etc instead of disposable anythings. And like (most?) millenials-ish, the kitchen is where we tend to hang out. My dishwasher isn't so that…

I've long wanted some kind of miniaturized version of a cafeteria dishwasher where you put dirty dishes in one side and clean dishes come out the other a few seconds later. I want my kitchen to stay clean and it would be so nice for everyone to be able to clean and put away their dish right after the meal.

Re: Nobody needs a faster dishwasher – solve real user needs

#400

Post by wheels » Tue, Mar 07, 2023, 2:24 PM UTC

jhoechtl wrote: post #286

wheels wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I often also do parties, where I cook for 20-ish people, and often have 3-4 dishwasher loads after a party. Speed does matter some. Where it matters a lot more is that I live in an condo where officially I'm not supposed to run my dishwasher after 10:00 p.m. The difference between 1 or 3 hours is significant there for running it after dinner. (I basically only run it after 10:00 p.m. after parties; got a very q…

This is also telling how thin the walls are where you live. I live in an old house with an old and fairly loud dishwasher. One door closed and there are no vibrations or noise problem. Can a dishwasher really become a noise problem?

No, I live in a new building with reinforced concrete external walls. But it's a general rule in Berlin. (Other German states have other rules, often with restrictions even earlier.)

And yes, I have been able to hear neighbors dishwashers before. Again, through the floor, not through the walls, though not in my current building (where I'm on the top floor).