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When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

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Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the Windows Terminal team reeks of this. There's so many blog posts saying look, we're so smart because they're reimplementing something both Linux and macOS had for *years*, as if the whole world of CLI was waiting for their savior.

I can’t speak to that. I’ve pretty much Linux only since 1999, but, of the times I’ve used PowerShell, I’ve like it.

PowerShell is available for Linux if you want to use it more without Windows.

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the Windows Terminal team reeks of this. There's so many blog posts saying look, we're so smart because they're reimplementing something both Linux and macOS had for *years*, as if the whole world of CLI was waiting for their savior.

I can’t speak to that. I’ve pretty much Linux only since 1999, but, of the times I’ve used PowerShell, I’ve like it.

[deleted]

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#393
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have. It's bad. Pavlov (one of the other comments) has it right with the Overton window comment: - Compared to ChromeOS or Android, Windows 11 is the ultimate in privacy. - Compared to Google Docs, Office 365 is the ultimate in privacy ... and so on. With Google's or Meta's surveillance infrastructure, if we get a Putin, Hitler, Stalin, Mao, or similar (and I'm by no means trying to equate those individuals), indiv…

Do you have concrete examples on how you would consider Android and Docs worse in terms of privacy? I'm trying to imagine how Google Docs could be worse than Microsoft Word stored in your One Drive, or Microsoft Word Online. Both services don't access your private word document unless required by law enforcement.

As examples:

1) Android keeps a log of everywhere I've been. It randomly turns on Google Assistant and records my voice. There is a ton of telemetrics going to Google, and no way to know what it is.

2) Google Docs literally keeps a keystroke-by-keystroke log of everything I've ever typed into Google Docs. If you typed the n-word and erased it 3 seconds later, that's in your permanent record.

3) Google lies about what data it collects and stores. Your Google Export won't include things like #2. That's a violation of GDPR.

As a footnote, #3 came up when I had my GSuite account attacked by an insider. I couldn't do forensics without a security up-sell. I wanted to know what IPs had accessed my accounts, at what times, and what they did. That kind of auditability once one tier up -- if I switched away from the (at the time free) tier, permanently.

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#394

Issue: Feeling bad after interaction with OSS developer at . Steps to reproduce: 1) Report a bug. 2) Get called dumb by developers at . 3) Demonstrate that it is, in fact, a bug with examples, test cases, and offer a potential fix/PR. 4) Hear that it’s being “handled internally”. 5) Wait for the blog post re-iterating what they called dumb, talking about how great the team is that fixed it, and see your demonstration…

I've pointed out flaws to the dev team at MS they were pretty quick about acknowledging it and fixing the problem. There were some showstoppers in the media encoders early on when they were developing win10. The only thing they asked is that I prove the issue was real and as soon as I did they were on top of it. They were also pretty quick and helpful with answering any question I had. I guess it depends on what team…

Reading your post feels good, man. But your last sentence kind of bothers me. Why do you feel they are insulting you now? I think, if at all, someone else was, and kept doing, and still is, insulting them instead.

I'm just trying to understand here, thanks. :)

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You've attributed the quote to the wrong person, it was not lhecker who said that. Ah, true. I definitely misattributed this statement. For this I apologize. > His comment argued it should all be able to handled in DirectWrite without using the alternative not that the alternative hadn't been thought of. His statement was "it isn't worth it" and "we ready doing it via the framework we're using" to only state, a yea…

I'm not sure I'm much of one for being able to untangle interpretations of chunks taken from comments spread over literal years but I think the distinction missing here is previously the WT team thought they could get away with using DirectWrite's built in approach to handle the precise issue. It was never that they didn't know there was an alternative to DirectWrite just they thought DirectWrite had a way to do it t…

I totally agree with you

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

we hope that you will accept our apology and understand we’re humans behind this product with a capability and willingness to learn from our past mistakes. Seems pretty sincere and decent to me.

Nah, this is the pestilent child response when they are wrangled into giving a "sincere" apology.

!! I like it, but you mean "petulant" .. "pestilent" may also apply though..

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> rants about how stupid everyone else is. > His favorite target seems to be...drumroll please...large corporation software teams. I missed the part where he is wrong.

the part where "he" is wrong, is the part where he tells everyone that his reference software can be compared to a real terminal. You cannot compare shoes with towels, nor cats with a TV. The tiling renderer "he" wrote as part of the reference software to demo isn't that bad as a product (to some degree), but that piece of software is garbage, as it has zero use. And almost none of the techniques "he" brags about can…

> the part where "he" is wrong, is the part where he tells everyone that his reference software can be compared to a real terminal

He very clearly states that his implementation is a terminal renderer.

> And almost none of the techniques "he" brags about can be applied to a real terminal

Elsewhere one of the people from the screenshots says "we implemented the same approach" because these techniques can be and have been applied. Both in Windows Terminal and, as I understand it, in every single modern terminal emulator.

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#398

Hi! I'm the person who wrote that blog post. If you have any questions whatsoever, please let me know! English is not my native language and "The solution is trivial" was meant sarcastic. The solution isn't trivial at all, nor is it complete, because solving the corner cases is complex. I'd also like to mention ahead of time that DirectWrite/Direct2D is very fast at drawing western (Latin) text without coloring (>200…

Your team needs to get the story straight. The other person in your team indicated it wasn't sarcasm. I couldn't imagine how bad your team would treat team members with inferior authority when your team treat your own users like this. Non native speaking skill is really no excuse here.

No disconnect whatsoever.. Just someone who wants to make promotion by writing a blogpost, and dismissing someone else's input.

Politics and ego that's all

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#399
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Baffles me that people think sarcasm is a good way to communicate on the internet. You are begging to be misunderstood, either accidentally, or maliciously.

It's not really sarcasm (which usually connotes contempt or mockery, which I suspect the blog writer didn't intend). It's irony, and irony has been widely used in written communication since we stopped using writing exclusively for record-keeping. It can and does work on the internet, provided (i) the writer is prepared to accept that a subset of readers won't "get it"; they'll fail to pick up on contextual clues tha…

Irony should not really be used in technical communication at all, though. The goal of technical writing is that as many readers "get it" as possible. Therefore, any rhetorical technique for which you have to "accept that a subset of readers won't 'get it'" is a bad technique for technical writing.

Re: When I tell the Windows Terminal team something is simple, I am "misguided"

#400
post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was wrong in how he approached the team. Everyone lacks tact in this exchange.

Just because you don't think he was polite to some arbitrary standard does not make him wrong. If people are this sensitive to "tone" and "tact" about technical matters, then we (as a community I guess) have much deeper issues then the technical matters themselves.

If you are looking for someone to do something for you, it's best to approach them in a way that won't make them upset with you. He didn't do that. His approach was obviously wrong as evidenced by the dust cloud it kicked up.

And your criticism of people who are "this sensitive to "tone" and "tact"" are equally applicable to Casey. He apparently didn't like the way the WT team talked to him. And it seems a lot of people in this very thread don't like the way the WT team is talking to everyone.

But you're not chastising Casey or everyone in this thread for being sensitive to tone and tact.

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