Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm • Hacker News Board

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#391

Post by LegitShady » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:33 PM UTC

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #376

dragonwriter wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From my point-of-view as a former firefighter, I would say this: > A building meant to house 4500 students, with only two entrances? I would think that, you being a former firefighter, you’d know that exits (for regular use and, even more so, emergency exits ) are not the same thing as (are generally a superset of) entrances. The plans for the building [0] show 10 escape stairs with dedicated exits (including the f…

I think probably you shouldn't be talking down to the firefighter about fire safety this way Most of what you said was already addressed

The architect didn't resign over fire safety. The fire safety discussion isn't really relevant. There are a lot of sprinkled buildings with rooms without direct exits or Windows. Most office building and many dorms etc even.

That's not a statement of support for the building just that it isn't why this architect found issue.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#392

Post by jtlienwis » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:34 PM UTC

I haven't trusted Charlie Munger at all since reading a paper he wrote about how wonderful an investment in Coca-Cola stock is. He told all about their great growth rate, cash flow etc but never once mentioned if drinking caffeinated sugar water on a regular basis is good for you (its not, its very unhealthy).

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#393

Post by lazide » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:34 PM UTC

ajross wrote: post #209

vmception wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

False dilemma. They could make the first floor have food courts and gyms, while having windows or simply not having a 97 year old billionaire donor dictate taste with zero input just because money. You are assuming a lot about whether the safety designs exist, or are adequate .

> You are assuming a lot about whether the safety designs exist, or are adequate. Uh, yes. Because there are laws governing how we can construct buildings in a safe way, and on the whole (c.f. the number of deaths in building fires over time) they work well. So I trust them. As far as the putative logic flaw, I don't see it. Everything is a tradeoff, even "because money". Saving money on the dorm means lower tuition,…

Lol - I have yet to see any cost savings passed through as lower tuition. More budget for sports, more administrator salaries, MAYBE an endowment but let’s not get too ahead of ourselves.

This is just squeezing the undergrads to feed the rest of the machine more efficiently.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#394

Post by LegitShady » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:36 PM UTC

fdr wrote: post #275

jl6 wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t find it unreasonable to assume that the building will comply with government fire safety regulations and that those regulations are at least somewhat adequate.

The regulations may have been written with architectural rules of thumb in mind, as in, "surely no one would..."

Building code isn't really written as rules of thumb but as rules.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#395

Post by lvspiff » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:36 PM UTC

jeffbee wrote: post #349

Avocadoe wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was curious about this as well but can't find any concrete sources. A blog [1] says the argument goes something like this: “The first $100,000 is a b*tch, but you gotta do it [...] I don’t care what you have to do—if it means walking everywhere and not eating anything that wasn’t purchased with a coupon, find a way to get your hands on $100,000. After that, you can ease off the gas a little bit.” [1] https://fourpi…

Is this 100k in 1950 dollars or what?

1990 was when the quote was made so 100k in 1990 dollars - so $200K today

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#396

Post by ghaff » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:37 PM UTC

colinmhayes wrote: post #127

gt565k wrote: post #28

Glad he had the balls to step down and call them out. The other committee members and people in charge of the project should be embarrassed as they failed to represent the best needs of the university and its students. Windowless dorms, crazy 97 year old billionaire amateur architect and a bunch of corrupt university staff and committee members who would do anything to save a few bucks. What could go wrong? Humanity…

What I don't understand is how this shithole costs so much? 1.5 billion for 4,500 residents comes out to 333,333 per resident. It feels like they could probably build normal dorms for that price.

It does sound like a lot of money but that is also a huge dorm. I couldn't find numbers on a more recent dorm project but MIT's Simmons Hall was completed in 2002. (Which also has sort of a weird window thing going on.) It "only" cost $78 million--so presumably something in excess of $100 million today. But that's for a dorm only housing 350 or so students vs. 4500. But, still you're looking at about 2x the cost per student housed.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#397

Post by canaus » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:37 PM UTC

altacc wrote: post #31

Saint_Genet wrote: post #4

"The idea was conceived by 97-year-old billionaire-investor turned amateur-architect Charles Munger, who donated $200 million toward the project with the condition that his blueprints be followed exactly." Absolutely amazing

Classic example of somebody becoming rich and thinking that makes them an expert on everything and the most qualified to solve any problem they cast their mind to. See also: just about every other billionaire on the planet.

Wait until you hear about programmers who frequent tech forums.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#398

Post by mindcrime » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:38 PM UTC

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #376

dragonwriter wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From my point-of-view as a former firefighter, I would say this: > A building meant to house 4500 students, with only two entrances? I would think that, you being a former firefighter, you’d know that exits (for regular use and, even more so, emergency exits ) are not the same thing as (are generally a superset of) entrances. The plans for the building [0] show 10 escape stairs with dedicated exits (including the f…

I think probably you shouldn't be talking down to the firefighter about fire safety this way Most of what you said was already addressed

It's all good. Just because I have experience as a firefighter and have some domain knowledge that the average joe lacks, doesn't mean I'm always right. And my comments above were based on, as I've said, limited knowledge as there are a lot of areas that TFA doesn't touch on.

I think this is a good discussion though, as maybe it exposes some members of the public-at-large to some thoughts on fire-safety that they haven't considered deeply before. If so, that's a win in my book.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#399

Post by tomtheelder » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:38 PM UTC

adenozine wrote: post #42

Jesus FUCK that's a horrible idea. My neighbor is a maintenance guy for a sober living complex and he has talked to me about maintaining these kinds of high density environments, and this seems like a nightmare scenario just waiting to happen. Also, just emotionally, this can't possibly work. There's no way to succeed in such a high pressure environment like those college years with so little space and so little priv…

In one of my years at a top 5 rated undergrad university I was in a ~100 sq. ft. windowless room as part of a 6 person suite with a decently large common room. That was a slightly unusual situation at my school (the windowless part, I mean), but remarkably like what is being proposed here. The overall building was quite a bit smaller and most of the rooms had windows and all that, but it really was almost the same from my perspective.

It was absolutely fantastic. I had a private space to sleep in and retreat to when necessary (a single is a major luxury for most undergrads!). I had a semi-private space shared with my suite-mates for work, socialization, etc. There were larger common spaces I could utilize around campus. It was my favorite housing situation I had while at school.

I could see it being a major problem for those who are highly socially reclusive, though.

Re: Architect Resigns in Protest over UCSB Mega-Dorm

#400

Post by bastardoperator » Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 4:38 PM UTC

ajross wrote: post #142

mindcrime wrote: post #91

From my point-of-view as a former firefighter, I would say this: A building meant to house 4500 students, with only two entrances? There's a word for that: deathtrap. Building this is setting UCSB up to be the site of the next Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire[1], Station Nightclub fire[2], or Hamlet Chicken Processing Plant fire[3]. At a first glance, based only on the information provided in the article, I'd say tha…

Surely building codes mandate a comprehensive evacuation design. There are clearly aesthetic complaints many people will have here, but realistically safety shouldn't be a problem. This is simply not a "large" building by skyscraper standards, and those can be built safely. Honestly... I think this is very much a taste thing. Is it so weird that I don't think this looks so bad at all? Yeah, yeah, no windows. But dens…

The design looked like rooms inside a pod inside a building. Seems like a fire in front of a single door could in theory kill everyone in the pod based on the image in the article.

Honestly, this looks like a low security prison to me. Small cells and a day room for activities and socializing.