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Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

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Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#391

Post by graycat »

RandVal30142 wrote: post #366
graycat wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's clear, from video, that the President's response to this was weasely equivocation. No, his response was terrific, good leadership, presidential, calm the violence. Your conclusion "weasely equivocation" was JUST from newsie GOSSIP, JUST as I wrote. It was just GOSSIP. You've been had. Why? The newsies wanted Trump to accept their dictation of what should be in his speech. Then (1) Trump looks like an obedient…

>Bluntly the newsies want violence, dead people The Nazis do. This is why they stabbed people in Seattle, this is why they called it a war, this is why one of them ran down civil demonstrators.

I don't know anything about US Nazis. But, maybe they exist -- I would not deny that they do. And, if they exist, then, sure stabbing people might be part of what they do.

Stabbing people is illegal, and we are awash in law enforcement to deal with that. But the law they broke was stabbing people. Being a Nazi may not actually be illegal. So, we don't lock them up for being a Nazi. We don't say, "Nazis stab people so that being a Nazi is reason enough to lock them up."

But, whether Nazis want to incite violence or not, IMHO too many newies essentially do, that is, are so outrageously irresponsible that they do incite violence.

Look at Trump's press conference today, at Trump Tower where he had just had a meeting on US infrastructure. Then he had a press conference. It's at YouTube, and I downloaded the MP4 and watched it all.

The newsies were totally out of control, kept shouting questions about essentially only the riots and interrupted Trump during his answers. Their goal? Somehow get Trump to say something really stupid, say, be really critical of some particular groups or persons, and, thus, get a battle going, start a fight, make some people A who didn't like what some people B said be more willing to attack people B, etc.

Then the newsies get to cover what Trump said, cover the maybe violent results in the streets, and then blame Trump. And a lot of Democrats, as already, will take this political opportunity and make the most of it. So, in effect, the nasty newsies want to stir people up, raise the temperature of the issues, and, hence, essentially incite violence. Trump tried to lower the temperature.

Look, 85+% of the whole riot situation was deliberately just to get it in front of the newsies so that they could raise the temperature and get more violence.

Net, the newsies want violence.

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#392

Post by RandVal30142 »

graycat wrote: post #391
RandVal30142 wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Bluntly the newsies want violence, dead people The Nazis do. This is why they stabbed people in Seattle, this is why they called it a war, this is why one of them ran down civil demonstrators.

I don't know anything about US Nazis. But, maybe they exist -- I would not deny that they do. And, if they exist, then, sure stabbing people might be part of what they do. Stabbing people is illegal, and we are awash in law enforcement to deal with that. But the law they broke was stabbing people. Being a Nazi may not actually be illegal. So, we don't lock them up for being a Nazi. We don't say, "Nazis stab people so…

>Net, the newsies want violence.

No that would be the Nazis shouting slogans about purging Jews.

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#394

Post by croon »

mantas wrote: post #239
croon wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The identity politics and pushing "undocumented" migrants angle Could you elaborate on this "going bananas"? > While the right seem to be business as usual. * Pushing through Gorsuch using nuclear option * Trying to deprive 10s of millions of people of healthcare multiple times without even publicly showing the proposed bill(s) * Banning cameras and reporters from briefings * Electing a GOP congressman one DAY AFTE…

> > The identity politics and pushing "undocumented" migrants angle > Could you elaborate on this "going bananas"? In most of Europe a major party advocating for legalising illegal migrants or opening borders doesn't stand a chance. This is why migrants vs refugees discussion is huge in Europe. People are OK to help refugees but most people don't want unlimited uneducated immigrants. The difference is what people see…

> US healthcare look 100% fucked up. Be it Obamacare or post or pre that. I don't see how GOP stance changed on this. They always were fucked up in this regard, they still are. Thus business as usual.

I was stating that they wanted to deprive a further 20 million people of healthcare, from the current system, ACA ("obamacare") which, while needing fixes, is still better than the old system. They (GOP) with a near complete unity (missing 3) tried to push through a bill with 12% (!) approval rating. If that is business as usual, the GOP took a wrong turn, you can't honestly deny that.

> I was talking about overall left vs right tendencies, not about single politicians. GOP was weird a decade ago, it still is now. Democrats went full retard IMO. I can't see what was going on their minds to push HRC.

Are you actually for real? You're saying that democrats went "full retard" in regards to nominating Hillary Clinton, and nothing is wrong when republicans went with Trump? Have you had your head in the sand for the last 6 months? Really?

I won't deny that Sanders would've had better chances, and most likely would've been elected, but there is a stark difference between effective politics and rational politics.

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#395

Post by DanBC »

graycat wrote: post #373
heartbreak wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

White supremacists came to my city and killed a woman 4 blocks up the street from my house, and the President's message was "there was violence on all sides". Only one side came to Charlottesville and killed someone. Only one side came to Charlottesville and chanted "Blood and Soil" while holding 200 torches in front of the Rotunda. Trump explicitly refused to acknowledge white supremacists when asked about it. The q…

If there has been crime in your neighborhood, then your local, state, etc. police, the FBI, DoJ, etc. should handle it. We're awash in law enforcement resources at every level. We should NOT settle the issue by fights in the streets. No political leader should single out one group or person with accusations of violence because: (A) It would tend to further divide the country. (B) It could stimulate opponents to feel…

> No political leader should single out one group or person with accusations of violence because:

You're defending trump for not condemning white supremacists. You say he's done nothing wrong, and should not condemn individuals.

But he does condemn Islamic extremists.

Is he wrong to do so?

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#396

Post by throwawaymanbot »

tptacek wrote: post #276
freehunter wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m sorry but if you’re sitting here defending Trump’s record on civil rights or white supremacy, you are not in any way a “moderate”. That is far-right extremism, and no, it’s not character assassination. Trump supports Nazis. That a not a moderate position to take.

This horrible thread is a perfect example of why HN users should reliably and diligently flag pure political stories like this one.

Interestingly, all my down votes come from when I criticize the alt-right. So when it comes to dilligence they are exceptional at mobbing at least. Not sure what HN would be like if they exercised more power.

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#397

Post by mantas »

croon wrote: post #394
mantas wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> > The identity politics and pushing "undocumented" migrants angle > Could you elaborate on this "going bananas"? In most of Europe a major party advocating for legalising illegal migrants or opening borders doesn't stand a chance. This is why migrants vs refugees discussion is huge in Europe. People are OK to help refugees but most people don't want unlimited uneducated immigrants. The difference is what people see…

> US healthcare look 100% fucked up. Be it Obamacare or post or pre that. I don't see how GOP stance changed on this. They always were fucked up in this regard, they still are. Thus business as usual. I was stating that they wanted to deprive a further 20 million people of healthcare, from the current system, ACA ("obamacare") which, while needing fixes, is still better than the old system. They (GOP) with a near com…

When was GOP for good healthcare? When did GOP had quality candidate? I said "business as usual" for GOP. As in, they're ~ same level of crap for the past few decades. They're not getting better, but they aren't getting worse either.

HRC nomination was either full retard or just being delusional and careless. It was truly painful to watch the campaign and see her (and to extent, Democrats) make mistake after mistake. I'm surprised she lost by such a small margin. But then it was loosing to Trump, which is even more surprising.

All in all, popcorn economy is doing great. I hope democrats will collect themselves and put up a reasonable candidate next time. Or maybe GOP will make progress. I don't see how they could get worse so only way is up.

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#398

Post by yellowapple »

cyphar wrote: post #259
cpr wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump did disavow the white supremacists. Not fast enough for them?

Not really. He didn't refer to them as white supremacists, and was far too moderate in condemning the violence that happened on behalf of the neo-Nazi protestors, referring to "violence on all sides". For a person who slammed the media and Obama for not "calling a spade a spade" on radial Islamic terrorism, it's quite hypocritical to then not "call a spade a spade" on white supremacist terrorism. To be clear, the lef…

"Counter-protestors weren't the ones to drive a car into a crowd."

But they were (among) the ones who showed up with baseball bats, clubs, and mace (and even a few guns). It's not like the protesters were the only ones ready for a fight.

"Counter-protestors weren't the ones to drive a car into a crowd."

That happened well after there had been a lot of fighting already.

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#399

Post by grasshopperpurp »

yellowapple wrote: post #398
cyphar wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. He didn't refer to them as white supremacists, and was far too moderate in condemning the violence that happened on behalf of the neo-Nazi protestors, referring to "violence on all sides". For a person who slammed the media and Obama for not "calling a spade a spade" on radial Islamic terrorism, it's quite hypocritical to then not "call a spade a spade" on white supremacist terrorism. To be clear, the lef…

"Counter-protestors weren't the ones to drive a car into a crowd." But they were (among) the ones who showed up with baseball bats, clubs, and mace (and even a few guns). It's not like the protesters were the only ones ready for a fight. "Counter-protestors weren't the ones to drive a car into a crowd." That happened well after there had been a lot of fighting already.

When you're defending white supremacists, it's time to take a step back and reevaluate your perspective.

Re: Intel CEO leaves American Manufacturing Council

#400

Post by itbeho »

grasshopperpurp wrote: post #399
yellowapple wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Counter-protestors weren't the ones to drive a car into a crowd." But they were (among) the ones who showed up with baseball bats, clubs, and mace (and even a few guns). It's not like the protesters were the only ones ready for a fight. "Counter-protestors weren't the ones to drive a car into a crowd." That happened well after there had been a lot of fighting already.

When you're defending white supremacists, it's time to take a step back and reevaluate your perspective.

Let's stop ignoring violence when it suits our own political agenda and start condemning it wherever it occurs. Racism has no place in our society and violent acts only fuel it. Pointing that out doesn't imply someone is "defending white supremacists".
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