Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

blog.mozilla.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

381–390 of 1001 posts

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#381

Post by lordCarbonFiber »

eternalban wrote: post #284
nostrademons wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This line of reasoning is very troubling to me, because 20 years ago it was pretty much unacceptable in the U.S. to hold the opinion that gays were entitled to full legal rights, let alone the ability to marry. That changed only because some very courageous people stuck their neck out, weathered all the flack and negative personal repercussions towards themselves, and gradually made the point of "Why not?" I fully su…

> this line of reasoning is very troubling to me .. This entire affair is troubling. This individual's livelihood was affected because of his socio-political views and activities. Your 2nd paragraph correctly underlines the more important issue.

Would you expect his views not to have consequences? I will gladly stand up for his right to hold opinions I disagree with, but the right to an opinion is not a shield from the consequences of those views. The board had just as much right to hold the opposite opinion and how they want the culture and outward face of their company to look like.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#382

Post by anaphor »

gyardley wrote: post #200

While this is a good first step, we're also going to need to boycott JavaScript and the companies that use it until JavaScript is replaced with a non-discriminatory alternative.

Strongly and statically typed languages are way more discriminatory though. The whole idea is to reject a certain class of programs as being illogical, just because of the way they use expressions.

Edit: e.g., http://blog.ezyang.com/2012/08/is-haskell-liberal-or-conserv...

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#383

Post by zabraxias »

chrismonsanto wrote: post #11

My #1 question -- is Eich returning to CTO, another position, or quitting altogether? All in all, I think this was a pragmatic move. I am not a fan of this "CEO = literally the company" logic, though. I saw no reason to believe that he would use Mozilla to further an anti-gay agenda.

He's leaving. Which is typical for CEOs even if his tenure ended positively.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#384

Post by ebbv »

andrewpi wrote: post #211
dopamean wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I generally agree with you but I think the problem here is that being against gay marriage is more than just a "political view." Being for low taxes is a political view. Being for smaller government is a political view. Believing a certain group of people don't deserve to live their lives like other simply because of who they love is not a political view. It reads as extremely hateful and that makes people uncomforta…

So Barack Obama, the President of the US, was against gay marriage in 2008; I'm confused as to why he gets a pass here, but the head of Mozilla doesn't?

Because he changed his stance. Brendan refuses to do so, he's defending his bigotry and standing by it.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#385

Post by dirtyaura »

ameen wrote: post #169
akerl_ wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would have considered him a worse person if he'd done that. I disagree with his opinions on marriage, but he has the right to have those opinions, and to provide support for causes he believes in. I'm not shocked the he is stepping down, or that others in the organization appear to have applied substantial pressure on him to do so, but it makes me sad. Their statements about supporting freedom of speech are hollow:…

Freedom of speech is to be exercised only for populist opinions. If we continue to travel down this path, we'd all have the same opinions, as anyone who dares to hold an different opinion than the majority would be ostracized from the society.

Not all opinions are equivalent. There are opinions that are factually wrong or ethically wrong in the context of accumulated and shared wisdom of the society.

If you stubbornly hold on to latter, is it bad to you eventually become ostracized? Should we respect a holocaust denier as a good member of the society? As a CEO? How about someone who doesn't deny it, but thinks it was a right thing to do?

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#386

Post by MrZongle2 »

matthewmacleod wrote: post #266
MrZongle2 wrote: post #48

Competency be damned! He held controversial opinions and supported like-minded causes! Destroy him! Edit: Downvotes, but no replies. Come on, kids...if you think I'm wrong then explain.

He held personal opinions which were incompatible with those of the organisation he was leading, and were actively opposed to the interests of many in the wider community he was a visible and important leader of. That's why there was so much backlash against the appointment, and in itself stands as evidence that he was not a suitable choice for the position.

First: thank you for responding, regardless of your up/down/no vote.

But I disagree that his personal opinions were incompatible with Mozilla. They make software, Eich makes software.

Mozilla has nothing to do with social activism. Well, at least, they didn't until now.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#387

Post by homulilly »

crassus wrote: post #283
dasil003 wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the community has pressured him to step down because he expressed an opinion not held by the majority. That's not true. The fact that the majority believe the idea was necessary for the pressure to be applied, but it is not why the pressure was applied. The pressure was applied because his views trample on others' rights, and equal rights is philosophically closely tied with the entire mission of an organization li…

You can turn any political belief into "someone's rights". There are people who believe abortion is a woman's right, and others that believe legal abortion is an unprecedented holocaust. I believe we should be able to work together and respect each other while we work that out. This is enforcing an ideological litmus test on the industry, policing people's internal beliefs. It is terrifying.

Personally, I feel the opposite. I think it's terrifying that so many in the tech industry apparently feel that ethics are irrelevant.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#388

Post by themoonbus »

homulilly wrote: post #270
Aloha wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an openly gay male, I came out at 15. Why should there be social or employment consequences - in my mind this is just as bad as when employers fire employees for being gay.

Being gay and being a bigot are not comparable, that's insane.

Being a bigot is a lifestyle choice, and I don't support it

(this is just a joke)

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#389

Post by oneeyedpigeon »

crassus wrote: post #347
DangerousPie wrote: post #45

I am a strong supporter of gay marriage, but I have to say that I find this very unfortunate and worrying. Apparently many Mozilla supporters seem to think it is okay to bully a qualified person out of his job only for his political views, even if they had absolutely no effect on his qualification or his actions on the job. I can't help but feel like this campaign has done a lot more harm to him than his $1000 donati…

The tech community needs to rewatch "The Lives of Others". Making ideological purity a precondition to employment is fucking terrifying. I'm terrified.

Jesus, no-one is arguing for that. Do you really think that 'being homophobic' and being 'ideologically pure' are right next to each other on some bizarre morality scale? They are MILES apart.
Post reply on HN