Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

openai.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

381–390 of 701 posts

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#381

Post by jdgoesmarching »

8338550bff96 wrote: post #143
serjester wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

75% of OpenAI's revenue is coming from their consumer business - the better question is the long term viability of their public API. But if they believe they're going to reach AGI, it makes no sense to pigeonhole themselves to the interface of ChatGPT. Seems like a pretty sensible decision to maintain both.

75%? Thats astonishing to me. Where are you able to see those details? It wouldn't surprise me if not a lot of enterprises are going through OpenAI's enterprise agreements - most already have a relationship with Microsoft in one capacity or another so going through Azure just seems like the lowest friction way to get access. If how many millions we spend on tokens through Azure to OpenAI is any indication of what oth…

This very good analysis estimates 73%, which includes team and enterprise. Given that enterprise access is limited and expensive, it seems Plus and Teams are mostly carrying this.

The whole financial breakdown is fascinating and I’m surprised to not see it circulating more.

https://www.wheresyoured.at/oai-business/

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#382

Post by james_marks »

cynicalpeace wrote: post #335
adventured wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference between Google had it just tried to be an enterprise search API, versus owning the consumer destination for search input/results.

Google will be a remembered as a victim of Schumpeter's Creative Destruction

From Wikipedia, for that don’t know the term: “a concept in economics that describes a process in which new innovations replace and make obsolete older innovations.”

Ironically, I had to google it, and agree with the comment.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#383

Post by rorytbyrne »

jdiez17 wrote: post #371
j45 wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds a little like aider.chat

It is quite similar but I found aider a bit clunky to use in that it creates a new commit with a huge message being the whole conversation and context. Which can be a good thing of course, but for most things I'd rather accumulate changes until a feature is finished, then I commit.

Just work on a branch and squash.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#384

Post by HeralFacker »

I wonder if the inherent public domain nature of genAI output will lead to licensing issues and forced code releases in the future.

Someone would have to prove slop code was used; but the same copyright issues with slop art apply, with the added complication of obscured licensing terms.

Where I work, genAI tools are banned because we do contracts that involve transfer of ownership with disclosure of third-party source. The lawyers state that, genAI's removal of attribution, it runs afoul of the disclosure requirement. It's a fireable offense to even have the tools installed on work computers/devices.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#386

Post by dumpsterdiver »

j0hnyl wrote: post #232
digital_sawzall wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is surprising to me as I have the exact opposite experience. I work in offensive security and chatgpt will add a paragraph on considering the ethical and legal aspects on every reply. Just a today I was researching attacks on key systems and ChatGPT refused to answer while Claude gave me a high level overview of how the attack works with code.

Really odd. ChatGPT literally does what I ask without protest every time. It's possible that these platforms have such large user bases that they're probably split testing who gets what guardrails all the time.

> It's possible that these platforms have such large user bases that they're probably split testing who gets what guardrails all the time.

The varying behavior I've witnessed leads me to believe it's more about establishing context and precedent.

For instance, in one session I managed to obtain a python shell (interface to a filesystem via python - note: it wasn't a shell I could type directly into, but rather instruct ChatGPT to pass commands into, which it did verbatim) which had a README in the filesystem saying that the sandboxed shell really was intended to be used by users and explored. Once you had it, OpenAI let you know that it was not only acceptable but intentional.

Creating a new session however and failing to establish context (this is who I am and this is what I'm trying to accomplish) and precedent (we're already talking about this, so it's okay to talk more about it), ChatGPT denied the existence of such capabilities, lol.

I've also noticed that once it says no, it's harder to get it to say yes than if you were to establish precedent before asking the question. If you carefully lay the groundwork and prepare ChatGPT for what you're about to ask it in a way that let's it know it's okay to respond with the answer you're looking for - things usually go pretty smoothly.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#387

Post by modeless »

I thought I didn't have this yet but turns out it's there, just buried in the drop down model selection menu. I tried it out on an existing chat thread where I was writing JavaScript and when I said "use canvas" it started rewriting my JavaScript to use HTML5 . I had to tell it "use canvas, not html5 canvas but chatgpt canvas" and then it figured it out.

It seems like this will be perfect for making tiny single page HTML/JS apps.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#388

Post by breck »

mmaunder wrote: post #26
scop wrote: post #14

I'm really happy to see ChatGPT doing this. The idea of a canvas made me really enjoy using Claude as I felt it to be the (so far) most "appropriate interface" to AI Chatbots as you are often doing two unique things in an AI chat: - holding in your mind a "thing" (i.e. some code) - talking about a "thing" (i.e. walking through the code) The same applies to non-code tasks as well. The ability to segregate the actual "…

Have you used it?

Not the op, but I just tried it. I agree with his point that this is a huge step up in having the discussion and then a separate canvas where the work takes place, and then iterations are done to the canvas.

I LOVE the UX animation effect ChatGPT added to show the canvas being updated (even if it really is just for show).

Here's my user test so you know I actually used it. My jaw begins to drop around minute 7: https://news.pub/?try=https://www.youtube.com/embed/jx9LVsry...

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#389

Post by danielmarkbruce »

dartos wrote: post #318
danielmarkbruce wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That prompts aren't science means little. If anything it makes them more important because you can't systematically arrive at good ones. If one spends a lot of time building an application to achieve an actual goal they'll realize the prompts make a gigantic difference and it takes an enormous amount of fiddly, annoying work to improve. I do this (and I built an agent system, which was more straightforward to do...)…

> If anything it makes them more important because you can't systematically arrive at good ones Important and easy to make are not the same I never said prompts didn’t matter, just that they’re so easy to make and so similar to others that they aren’t a moat. > I may be wrong - but I'll speculate you work on infra and have never had to build a (real) application that is trying to achieve a business outcome. You’re ve…

There is a lot of nonsense in here, for example:

> but we know that synthetic datasets make for poor training data

This is a silly generalization. Just google "synthetic data for training LLMs" and you'll find a bunch of papers on it. Here's a decent survey: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2404.07503

It's very likely o1 used synthetic data to train the model and/or the reward model they used for RLHF. Why do you think they don't output the chains...? They literally tell you - competitive reasons.

Arxiv is free, pick up some papers. Good deep learning texts are free, pick some up.

Re: Canvas is a new way to write and code with ChatGPT

#390

Post by rglover »

vercantez wrote: post #79

Wish they explained how they perform targeted edits. Is it doing speculative decoding like Anthropic’s code edit or something like Aider’s diff format?

Probably even simpler. Give the full context and then add the text selection as an additional message step/context of what to edit.
Post reply on HN