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MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

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381–390 of 413 posts

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But then don't let people pay for expensive upgrades that have no performance benefit. The number of people who want performance stats, or at least think they need, far outnumber the amount of people who need performance. It makes absolute sense to sell these lemons, even though it is unethical.

> or at least think they need, Irrelevant. If you pay premium for performance expecting to get the level of performance you've paid for then you better get what you've paid for. Otherwise we're dealing with something very similar to consumer fraud covered with a thin paternalist veil of "corporation knows best".

> pay premium [...] get what you've paid for

That makes no sense. "Premium" strictly means "at a higher cost." You can't possibly get what you have paid for with premium products, because some of your money has been spent purchasing the premium.

Regardless of sour reviews such as this one, most people will continue to buy Apple products because Apple sales have managed to transcend the quality of their products. Apple will continue to push the boundaries of what is acceptable and people will continue to buy their products, defend them and praise them - no different from the past decade.

The fault lies squarely with consumers. Apple is just doing what they are being asked to do: flatter things, bigger numbers, higher prices.

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#382
post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the operating temperature of a mac laptop max out at something like 35c ? That's woefully low for anywhere it gets hot, like Australia for example. It basically means that on a hot day in summer you cannot use your laptop unless you're indoors in air conditioned comfort. EDIT: Yes, I checked, the MacBook Air has an operating temperature of 10-35c and a storage temperature of -25-45c, which means that it's techn…

I think you'll find that any device with a lithium ion battery will have similar temperature ratings if the manufacturer is being honest. Everything else in the machine is fine with much hotter temperatures, but cooking the battery is a bad idea.

The battery heat issue is especially problematic with LiPo cells, since they tend to swell up and break open the surrounding device enclosure.

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#383
post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They recommend I open up the device myself? Thereby voiding warranty? Isn't that getting more and more difficult?

This may have changed, but for years the apple warranty was "as long as you don't damage anything, you're allowed to open it". I did some research and at least the manual for my machine still states this, but mine is also from 2012

I took a 2011 model in since I just needed a replacement battery due to bulging. The Apple employee was flabbergasted that I had removed the screws and bottom plate saying I had voided the warranty... on a severely out of warranty device. He was insistent that any device that had screws in it would have the warranty voided if those screws were removed and the device opened, even after showing him the manual which instructs the user on how they can open the device to replace the hard drive in the section labeled "Boost your MacBook Pro" starting on page 35. https://manuals.info.apple.com/MANUALS/1000/MA1602/en_US/mac...

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may not hurt their margins much to use more expensive thermal compound, but it definitely won't help them in any meaningful way. These products are optimized for real-world bursty workloads that basically never hit a serious thermal limit that better paste could help with. Even on the desktop chips, delidding and replacing the thermal compound provides no benefit until you're pretty far into overclocking territory…

But the price for this machine is crazy, and it doesn't support a use case where you actually use the i9 cpu for long periods of time... Why do you need it then? To open the browser a few milliseconds faster? It's not a professional machine if it's throttling heavily under load so you can't use its resources....it boggles my mind that it's even allowed to sell something like this. It's like selling a supercar which c…

Not disagreeing with you, but as it happens the Bugatti Veyron can't do the full top speed for very long (Michelin won't guarantee the tires to run above 250 mph for more than 15 minutes.).

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Running your CPU hotter doesn't significantly affect the lifespan of your device especially for longer sustained periods unless there's some glaring design defect as happened to Nvidia. So that's actually pretty well optimized.

> Running your CPU hotter doesn't significantly affect the lifespan of your device Maybe, but I've seen reliability formulas with fifth powers of temperature, namely for equivalent ageing of devices. And 14nm fabrication processes don't exactly improve my expectations of durability ...

It helps if you know 14 nm fabrication isn't really 14 nm. The biggest culprits are electrolytic capacitors and the lipo batteries but the batteries are far away and the other components are cooled by the air headed into the fan so neither will actually reach anywhere near the temperature of the CPUs. Apple also doesn't skimp on components like this especially when it's a core and obvious part of optimizing for noise so I wouldn't expect it to have an appreciable impact on the lifespan of the device.

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#386
post #250
post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a bare-die CPU or GPU is not fully covered, the uncovered portions will rapidly become hot and the chip may die (especially if the thermal sensors are covered and cannot detect this). This is different from modern desktop processors where there is an IHS to help spread the heat around - there is a very real danger to insufficient paste application on a bare die. In contrast, since modern thermal pastes are non-con…

> since modern thermal pastes are non-conductive, there is no real downside to an enthusiastic application of paste except for making a mess, so you want to default to putting too much on rather than having some dumb intern kill a PC with an insufficient application. There is virtually no effect on thermals. The effect on thermals are absolutely not insignificant. Thermal pastes are actually extremely bad at transfer…

High mounting pressure will squeeze out excess thermal paste which greatly narrows the difference between the most and least conductive compounds when both surfaces are fairly smooth and even in while in contact.

https://www.overclockers.com/heatsink-mounting-pressure-vs-p...

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#387
post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a bare-die CPU or GPU is not fully covered, the uncovered portions will rapidly become hot and the chip may die (especially if the thermal sensors are covered and cannot detect this). This is different from modern desktop processors where there is an IHS to help spread the heat around - there is a very real danger to insufficient paste application on a bare die. In contrast, since modern thermal pastes are non-con…

> if the thermal sensors are covered and cannot detect this Modern chips seem to have sensors specifically detecting hotspots . E.g. with an AMD Polaris GPU, you can see "Hotspot Temperature" in HWiNFO.

Yes but they might not have as high a density of sensors at the periphery/uncore.

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When working as intern at an Apple store more than 10 years back the instructions from Apple for reassembly would always tell to put a huge amount of thermal grease on the CPU. So much that it would be squirted out from under the heatblock in large blobs. I always found it odd as I was used to add just as much as was needed without spilling over. Never read any research on it though so I'm curious what was the right…

The best scenario is full contact between the CPU/GPU/whatever makes the heat and the heatsink. No product that is put between those elements will make heat dissipation get any better, as it won't change the composition of the heatsink or of the CPU/GPU surface. Now, in real life, CPU, GPU and heatsink don't have the perfect, more-than-mirror finished surface. There are small gaps and small peaks that prevent a full…

It's even better to add more paste and high mounting pressure which is what Apple does.

https://www.overclockers.com/heatsink-mounting-pressure-vs-p...

Re: MacBook Pro with i9 chip is throttled due to thermal issues, claims YouTuber

#390
post #132
post #75

This madness is something Apple can only blame themselves for. It's Steve Jobs' ploy to kill the laptop market. He didn't need the laptop market, he had the iPhone, he knew of the iPad when he demo'd the Macbook Air. Today the entire Mac revenue https://www.statista.com/statistics/382260/segments-share-re... is below 10%. See, he have started the thin craze and everyone copied. But noone needs a thin laptop. There's…

I really doubt even Jobs thought his RDF extended to the entire laptop market. He just had a great idea and Apple executed on it. The early MBA's (2010) were absolutely fantastic, quiet and reasonably powerful (read completely usable). As an anecdote, new hires at my company are given either a somewhat heavy ThinkPad or MPB (higher end). Many have complained about the weight of the ThinkPad. None complain when they c…

This just shows Apple items are fashion items which you can't do a technical comparison with. The ThinkPad T580 is 4.29lbs where the Macbook Pro 15" is 4.02lbs. I am sure the four ounces made a huge difference. If you wanted to compare it to the 5.4lbs P52 then may I point out the GTX 1060 level GPU which is quite a bit faster than the Macbook Pro? Not to mention the 128GB RAM capacity or the multiple M.2 SSD support. They are entirely different machines for different purposes.
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