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Donald Trump Is Elected President

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Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#361

Post by taivare »

ahoy wrote: post #51
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #17

Now that the voices of the disenfranchised blue collar workers have been heard, what actually can be done to help them? I'm less worried about the accusations of racism, etc. because it appears to me a majority are voting because their livelihoods have been lost and, despite economics saying globalization will bring new jobs, they aren't showing up in the critical areas where they are needed. So, what policies can be…

The working poor voted for Hillary. Trump's support comes from households making $50,00 or greater.

Not in Ohio, last night was revenge of the Reagan Democrats for NAFTA , and many of those voters are below $50,000 household.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#362

Post by paulddraper »

Delmania wrote: post #134
themckman wrote: post #74

So, I voted for DJT (I like calling him that, for some reason). I didn't vote for him because I agreed with any of his policies (as best I can tell he never actually presented any during the course of his campaign) or because I thought he was the best representative for the people of this country. I did so for a couple of reasons: 1. I like a good underdog story. The people that support him, for a multitude of reason…

> . Yeah, there are some loud one saying some ridiculous things, but I refuse to believe that close to half the country hates people of color and wants to completely isolate us from the rest of the world by closing our borders. It just can't be true. You've never been to the deep south, much the south, have you? > 2. I believed he was the candidate with the biggest chance of winning that would bring about the biggest…

You do realize that a black man was just elected as president twice, by a respectable margin each time?

So...like the parent said, most Americans don't hate colored people. I do think most Americans are frustrated by Obamacare, haphazard foreign involvement, and bailouts.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#363

Post by finiter »

micahbright wrote: post #85
dopamean wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the crux of why Trump's pandering to them was total bullshit. He can't do anything to help them because the jobs that left aren't coming back. In four years they will be in the same position they are now but they wont have a black man or a Democrat to blame for it and so they wont be quite as bitter about it.

It didn't help that while he was "bullshitting", Hillary was calling them deplorable. Empathy for the win.

You have it backwards. She was trying to differentiate his racist support from his "we're worried about our jobs" support. Read the text of her speech.

"You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump’s supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right? The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamaphobic — you name it. [...] But the other basket — and I know this because I see friends from all over America here — I see friends from Florida and Georgia and South Carolina and Texas — as well as, you know, New York and California — but that other basket of people are people who feel that the government has let them down, the economy has let them down, nobody cares about them, nobody worries about what happens to their lives and their futures, and they’re just desperate for change. It doesn’t really even matter where it comes from. They don’t buy everything he says, but he seems to hold out some hope that their lives will be different. They won’t wake up and see their jobs disappear, lose a kid to heroine, feel like they’re in a dead-end. Those are people we have to understand and empathize with as well."

EDIT: The transcript I pulled this from: http://time.com/4486502/hillary-clinton-basket-of-deplorable...

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#365

Post by giardini »

happytrails wrote: post #32
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #17

Now that the voices of the disenfranchised blue collar workers have been heard, what actually can be done to help them? I'm less worried about the accusations of racism, etc. because it appears to me a majority are voting because their livelihoods have been lost and, despite economics saying globalization will bring new jobs, they aren't showing up in the critical areas where they are needed. So, what policies can be…

Those old jobs are never coming back.

I'm not so sure about that.

Robots will not be immediately cost-effective for all production and it may be 30 years before they permeate manufacturing. Until then humans will serve.

I've complained on HN about the low quality of many goods (e.g., nail clippers) and about how the supply chain to US consumers today is no better than it was in my youth more than 50 years ago. Most of you were not yet around to know what the supply chain was like 50 years ago so please suspend your disbelief.

QC in some countries appears impervious to consumer feedback; they couldn't produce a decent set of pliers 20 years ago and they cannot today. They may never succeed due to their unique social and political histories. Lack of communication and competitive feedback in non-free markets inhibits quality. In contrast USA manufacturers 50 years ago and earlier produced very high quality goods (many still in use!).

I expect the USA to bring back production of high-quality goods and a more robust supply chain. Until someone invents a Star Trek replicator, I expect JIT inventory management to be discarded in many industries; it's primary benefit was bigger bonuses for MBAs.

No education I know of available today will prepare youth for the future they face. Once machine learning and AI become widely embedded in manufacturing and commerce, skills required will be beyond the ability of most. Meanwhile grades are falling and testing becoming more lenient.

Someday almost no one will have a job. We should plan accordingly.

Just for fun, see the movie "Idiocracy ":

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1

Thread on IMDB discussing the relevance of "Idiocracy" to Trump's victory today:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/board/nest/257141945?ref...

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#366

Post by tengbretson »

micaksica wrote: post #246
stefs wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

reddit user TPKM's comment on the sanders-would-have-won-thread: "Support for Trump, much like Brexit, was based upon an extremely widespread feeling that average people are not getting their fair share of the benefits of globalisation. This is neither a specifically Democrat or Republican problem, and people have been saying it one way or another for years. It was also the foundation of Sanders' campaign. The differ…

> curbing immigration is an actual solution to the problem. Curbing immigration won't be a solution to the problem; it's just a highly visible one. Each immigrant that is looking for a job in the US is taking one away from the supply for an American. That is how the Trumpistas see things. Economically, sure, that's true. The immigrants take jobs from the labor supply. What people don't see is that aside from ones on…

> 2. not jobs that these people actually want anyway, so at worse you will see a lot of inflation, or a lot of open job positions. It doesn't make sense, but it won't really make sense.

Is it your intuition that the labor market would not adjust to a lower supply by becoming more desirable? If not, why?

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#367

Post by Inthenameofmine »

jernfrost wrote: post #332

Maybe this could be a golden age for Europe and Canada. We can get all the intelligent people in the US fleeing to seek more intelligent shores. We could get some of the bright minds of Silicon valley to come across the pond and help revitalizing European tech industry. Not a new phenomenon. The German scientists fleeing Nazi Germany started the present American scientific lead. The French Hugenots fleeing France cau…

Maybe Canada, however, Europe is doing the same insanity to itself atm.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#368

Post by IMTDb »

jernfrost wrote: post #215
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #17

Now that the voices of the disenfranchised blue collar workers have been heard, what actually can be done to help them? I'm less worried about the accusations of racism, etc. because it appears to me a majority are voting because their livelihoods have been lost and, despite economics saying globalization will bring new jobs, they aren't showing up in the critical areas where they are needed. So, what policies can be…

You can do what the democrats have talked about, which we have successfully done in Nordic countries which is to spend a lot of money on re-educating the workforce and making sure those at the bottom get decent skills. I grew up in a rustbelt like industrial town in Norway. We has shipyards, glass factory, paper mill, textile industry, lock systems etc. Almost all of it got closed down and moved overseas as I grew up…

USA does not have an oil fund that amounts do $150k per capita to pay for "free everything" (university education, universal health care, childcare) and good pensions for everybody. Norway generates more revenue with oil than the entires US of A, for 5 million people, and is third worldwide exporter for Natural Gas just behind Qatar and Russia, again with only 5 million people to serve (less than the population of New York)

The policies you enjoy are paid for by those revenue, and are not applicable to "regular" countries.

I admit tho that your politician did a good job at ensuring that those revenue are used for the good of the general population and are managed with the future in mind.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#369

Post by utefan001 »

blakeyrat wrote: post #294
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #17

Now that the voices of the disenfranchised blue collar workers have been heard, what actually can be done to help them? I'm less worried about the accusations of racism, etc. because it appears to me a majority are voting because their livelihoods have been lost and, despite economics saying globalization will bring new jobs, they aren't showing up in the critical areas where they are needed. So, what policies can be…

I live in a relatively small suburb of Seattle. I'm a software developer. There are no jobs for me where I live. None. None within 20 miles. The only job for me is in Seattle or Bellevue or Redmond, an hour-long commute. I love where I live, and I don't want to live in Seattle (which I could barely afford anyway-- I like owning a house). I also don't want to exclusively work-from-home and be cut-off socially from my…

This is the best idea I have heard all year. Centralizing too many jobs where the cost of living is so high creates an "us vs them" mentality.

Re: Donald Trump Is Elected President

#370

Post by cortesoft »

lordnacho wrote: post #81
SolaceQuantum wrote: post #17

Now that the voices of the disenfranchised blue collar workers have been heard, what actually can be done to help them? I'm less worried about the accusations of racism, etc. because it appears to me a majority are voting because their livelihoods have been lost and, despite economics saying globalization will bring new jobs, they aren't showing up in the critical areas where they are needed. So, what policies can be…

Jobs that can't be exported are safe from movement. Hairdressing and cleaning for instance. That doesn't mean the person doing it can't be an immigrant, though, so perhaps by restricting immigration you reduce competition for it. Jobs that compete with similar jobs in other countries can potentially benefit from trade barriers. Make foreign cars expensive and there will be substitution with local cars. Long term it's…

Sure, with fewer immigrants there is less competition for hairdresser jobs.... but there is also less demand for haircuts. Immigrants aren't just competition for jobs, they are also new customers.
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