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Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

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Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#351

Post by otakucode »

dankohn1 wrote: post #228
swatkat wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. Because they are being themselves, and are connected to the natural wellspring of motivation that comes from genuine interest, while you are the salmon swimming upstream, aping societal ideals and trying to be someone you are not. >> Almost no one takes my advice because it's so threatening to be natural. What if you are not naturally ambit…

> Basically, comparison causes conflict, conflict causes anxiety, anxiety causes fear, and fear makes mind dull. Unfortunately, I can report that I have done all of my best work in my career when I was extraordinarily anxious, feeling like I was holding to the side of the cliff with just my fingernails. Whenever things have started to get too comfortable, I found that hubris has disrupted my successes. It's a sad tho…

>I see absolutely no reason to believe that the natural state of humanity is to be happy (or, more specifically, content)

What about the fact that stress is tremendously destructive to our health? It is directly a threat to the survival of both individuals and the societies they live in. If being in an anxious state for extensive periods of time were the most advantageous to survival, then evolution seems not to have noticed it. The structure and functioning of our endocrine system heavily suggests that humans were built for occasional short bursts of high stress, not extended periods of constant high stress (as we have designed society to require of most people).

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#352

Post by yarou »

vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

This advice is easy to give but difficult to follow in practice. Krishnamurrthi wrote from a position of pure arrogance, because he was told his whole life that he was a special person. He's not special; he's just repeating what others have said in a watered down package. That's what makes his philosophy so dangerous.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#353

Post by otakucode »

diminoten wrote: post #276
thegreatpeter wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Basically, comparison causes conflict, conflict causes anxiety, anxiety causes fear, and fear makes mind dull. There's no intelligence where there's fear. Key here is to eliminate comparison. What a great quote

I disagree with it. The fires of conflict forge the deepest bonds. I find I don't end up being comfortable with someone until we've argued about something. One of my favorite ways to become friends with someone is to find something we disagree on and debate it.

That particular sort of disagreement is underlaid by much more fundamental agreement. If you did not share a tremendous amount with the person, such a debate would not be possible. Debate is not a competition in situations where the participants agree upon the fundamental means of determining truth, it is a collaboration. All participants are attempting to reach the truth through contributing facts and reasoning. A conflict would be if one person was of the belief that truth is determined by the intuitive feeling of correctness and another believing it to be determined by rational soundness and correspondence with reality. In that case, neither can contribute anything which helps the other person reach understanding, giving rise to competition.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#354

Post by discreteevent »

kmjnhb wrote: post #278
thegreatpeter wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Basically, comparison causes conflict, conflict causes anxiety, anxiety causes fear, and fear makes mind dull. There's no intelligence where there's fear. Key here is to eliminate comparison. What a great quote

It's like a cross between "Fear is the mind-killer" from Dune, and something Yoda would say. And to actually add something useful to the discussion, I'll add that I think the key to dealing with fear, and distressing emotions in general, is not to try to get rid of it, but to learn to function effectively in it's presence. Sometimes fear is a valid response, and should be respected. A lot of the time, fear is not a u…

Yes of course it is very important in some situations.

"To survive in grand prix racing, you need to be afraid. Fear is an important feeling. It helps you to race longer and live longer." - Ayrton Senna.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#355

Post by moments »

boatzart wrote: post #333
vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

I've never heard of Jiddu Krishnamurthi before today. Can you recommend a book of his?

To Be Human: long and comprehensive (not actually written by him, but a collection of his works).

Flight of the Eagle: short and comprehensive.

Freedom from the Known: short and practical.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#356

Post by Squarel »

tastyface wrote: post #155
vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

OP here. Believe me when I say that there's nothing more I'd rather do than what I'm doing right now. Not even in question. I love programming, I love the project I'm working on, and I love the ideas that are waiting to be worked on in my future. My heart fills with joy when I think about holding those finished products in my hands. When I get into the flow, I can zone out for days and work on my projects with hardly…

I have come to accept that my way of working is in bursts. Whether this is at a 9-5 admin job (work intensely 9-10:30, slow down until 12, work intensely 1-2:30, take it easy the rest of the day unless something comes up), or working on projects (do nothing for a week or two, or a month, then push out a months work in a week).

While studying, I used to beat myself up about the fact that I could not get into the habit of reading every night, and studying a few hours every day.

Sure, sometimes if I just go and start doing the task I need to do, then it starts to flow, but mostly if my head is not in the right place to do it, then what you get is lackluster output.

Some people are the "Work steadily on a regular basis" on a project, others are the "18h days for 5 days and then done with the whole thing".

The concerning part of your post is that you feel you would sit in front of the TV depressed. Have you checked with your doctor if you are actually depressed?

Beyond that, it took me until my early 30s to realise that I should not beat myself up for not operating the way I assumed everyone else does. Ironically, people are under the impression that I work non-stop all the time or that I studied every night, because that is how they perceive that I must be doing things. Once I found this out from talking to people that I was in awe of, only to find they thought I was doing fairly well and must be working my butt off, I realised that even though I have a tendency to beat myself up about my work patterns, I should perhaps give myself a little more leeway and look at the results.

Perhaps it comes down to pressure as well, some people work very badly under deadline pressure, others are unable to be productive until they have the deadline pressure, but have had all the details in their minds for the rest of the project.

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#358

Post by krick »

vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

Wow, that was well said. I'm not that often genuinely impressed by what I read on HN. Never've read anything by Jiddu Krishnamurthi, could you recommend something?

Re: Ask HN: How do you deal with professional jealousy and getting older?

#360

Post by G650 »

vijucat wrote: post #64

> It's been getting better. It's not, it's getting worse. You are in a cycle of slave-driving yourself. You remind me of Jiddu Krishnamurthi's assertion that "Influence acts strongest when you don't realize that it is acting". I would venture that most of your accomplishments are a result of being told what you should do, what you should be. You will NEVER have the energy that the people whom you compare with have. B…

Amazing. You inspired me to write a blog post.
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