Live data from Hacker News

We need to reclaim our attention

theguardian.com

351–360 of 458 posts

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think children are excluded from the definition of "men".

Surely not by the above moral axiom.

Surely by it. I would struggle to find a precedent where children are considered equal to adults, and not subject to their authority. In fact my whole point is we shouldn't treat adults the same way we do children.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure. This is just a data point of 1. I used to browse Instagram casually. Like, once is a blue moon. I would see updates from my network and spend a few mins here and there. This was probably like over year or two back. (not 100% sure) And then a few months back I just could not take my eyes off of Instagram reels. This feature wasn't there before I think. I was just completely hooked. It was pretty interes…

I go on Facebook about once a month. I’ve noticed that Facebook’s friend recommendation engine now sprinkles in some beautiful women, with whom I have no friends in common. I don’t know if someone tuned the algorithm this way, or if it tuned itself. It feels like the desperate move of a platform that realizes it’s losing control of someone.

Perhaps you just got lucky. Mine suggests tons of people from India and the middle east who I couldn't possibly know. I also check it very rarely. Presumably the algorithm must be picking the (very-slightly) best from many many low-probability guesses.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#353
post #318
post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developped countries share the same technologies, but this obesity and diabetes problem you're talking about seems largely rooted in North America. You're a little quick to correlate screens and health metrics. I don't think that explanation holds up at all if you consider data in other countries.

> Developped countries share the same technologies, but this obesity and diabetes problem you're talking about seems largely rooted in North America. In France ("the land of delicate and healthy food", as it is sold to you), obesity rate was multiplied by 3 since the 80s. Overweight rate raised by 50%. Diabetes has also been on the raise: double or tripled since the 90s. You know, in general all the crap that develop…

> France ("the land of delicate and healthy food", as it is sold to you)

Is it? I would associate that description more with Italy. With France I associate butter, cream, cheese, fatty cuts of meat ...

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#354
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had that discussion this week end. I wonder if it will be any different from our Game boys? Or is the problem that smaller children get their hands on them?

It will be different. Playing Pokémon or Mario is much different than the endless scroll of TikTok, YouTube Kids, or a lot of the games.

Ye probably. I looked into what Nintendo does nowadays and luckely they seem to have not ditched their anachronistic cartridge design, even though there seem to be internet stores built in into "New 3DS". I guess they are opt in.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely agree. I see anecdotal evidence of this everywhere. Its most noticicble with people who spend a lot of time "online" browsing placing like twitter, reddit, and tiktok (or even older folks who watch too much "mainstream" cable tv news). They tend to hold derivative and thoughtless "stock" worldviews that are clearly directly borrowed from the feed they subscribe to and not a result of deciding for themselve…

The anti-work content on reddit should be analyzed by the feds a bit. It is promoting illegal sabotage of workplaces much of the time. It is also very similar to an organic movement from China that got banned and censored just before it suddenly became a top three thread on reddit every day for all of this year. I suspect movements and divisions that are studied and analyzed in (adversarial nation) are then exported,…

Have you considered that there are just a lot of people whose work lives are so horrible (because they don't have cushy tech jobs for example) that they might completely and utterly despise the work-worshipping society we live in? Many Americans, let alone people in poorer places, are forced to work like dogs, often under inhumane conditions, for compensation that barely earns them a dignified standard of living. It's a far simpler explanation than believing there must be some coordinated effort to topple America via propaganda on a little subreddit. Sometimes the lack of empathy shown by commenters on hackernews with the living conditions of their fellow humans is really jarring to me.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Negative, in this context, can constitute enough for whatever grievance that enough users are unhappy with their customer experience. To take this discussion from the normative to the practical, I do not believe the appropriate government role here would be to act as sole regulator but rather aid those users who are aggrieved by these businesses in more precise actions, such as filing amicus briefs in class action su…

> These supportive, assistive, incentive-based actions All of these actions are done with the threat of fines for noncompliance, and the threat of imprisonment for noncompliance with the fines. They are also financed by taxation, which is involuntary and redistributive by nature. > Then there simply should be more powerful NGOs If these NGOs do not occur naturally, then there's clearly not enough demand for them. Thi…

> All of these actions are done with the threat of fines for noncompliance, and the threat of imprisonment for noncompliance with the fines.

How is filing an amicus brief or funding third party groups in danger of anything like that? There’s no regulation involved.

> If these NGOs do not occur naturally, then there's clearly not enough demand for them.

They already do, e.g. https://www.ofsms.org/

> why not just be content with the fact that most people are not interested in forming voluntary collectives

Why are you insistent on claiming the nonexistence of information asymmetry?

> They are also financed by taxation, which is involuntary and redistributive by nature.

Ah if we go down that route of normative woolgathering then we can next call property theft and even land (or at least rent) theft, and continue this endless wheel of rhetorical Samsara.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#357
post #331

"There is something in our soul that loathes true attention much more violently than flesh loathes fatigue. That something is much closer to evil than flesh is. That is why, every time we truly give our attention, we destroy some evil in ourselves. If one pays attention with this intention, fifteen minutes of attention is worth a lot of good works." (Simone Weil, Waiting for God )

Brilliant quote, thank you. This book has been on my reading list so I think I'll go ahead and get it now.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#358
post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think many of your examples are of times we failed to counter problematic tendencies as a society, gave up, and then even worse (in this case, more addictive time consuming activities) things come along. It's basically the realization of a slippery slope, where failure to stop one problematic trend is used to justify an even worse trend. Society can survive with bad tendencies. Think about 50 years ago when America…

"it's hard to imagine the world without them" There is soviet sci-fi novel that features a distopian society where people a killed before they become frail and become a burdain, and its considered an honour. They can't imagine the world otherwise.

I think that was also a storyline in a Twilight Zone episode.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, in same vein, you can tell addict to 'just drop that needle', yet few do. Or cigarettes. Addictive behavior is, well, addictive, and few in population have the mental will to shed it off themselves once they get hooked. Tobacco clearly kills you (and people around), ruins you and make you stink like pile of old crap. We still allow it, but regulate it heavily since bad effects are out there, everywhere. TBH I d…

I'd start by questioning why you think addicts should discontinue their habits? Why do you think you know what's good for someone more than they do? If an addict says "I like my addiction, thank you very much", what gives you the right to intervene?

the societal cost is why intervention is justified. you know, the basis of all laws? we don't live in an anarchy. unless you live completely sustainably with no dependence or impact on others' resources, society has a right to intervene.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#360
post #2

This for me is key, these sorts of problems cannot just be solved on an individual level. They are systemic. "Individual abstinence is “not the solution, for the same reason that wearing a gas mask for two days a week outside isn’t the answer to pollution. It might, for a short period of time, keep certain effects at bay, but it’s not sustainable, and it doesn’t address the systemic issues.” He said that our attentio…

Except I have no choice but to walk through an area which might be polluted. I do have a choice to not read news sites for four hours a day. The article fails to define both the problem and the solution. How exactly this “attention theft” causes significant negative societary consequences is defined extremely vaguely, and almost exclusively through personal anecdotes. The offered solutions, forcing employers to respe…

Sure you have a choice. But much like with wearing a gas mask, people will think you're weird and you'll end up alone.
Post reply on HN