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Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

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Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#351

Post by phreeza »

buildbuildbuild wrote: post #201

Cryptocurrency is a blind spot where Hacker News’ normal optimism towards innovation has disappointed for a decade. May this thread be one we can reference years later as another example of “our collective opinions can be very wrong about technologies that were transformative in hindsight.” Innovators, follow regulations and go for it. Don’t let the HN crowd get you down. Few of these commenters have ever been unbank…

Doesn't the fact that bitcoin hasn't taken off yet kind of validate the reservations that HN has?

If Dropbox was still at 100 active users 10 years later, would someone be complaining about the dismissive comments HN had at the launch announcement?

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#352

Post by pjc50 »

RhodoGSA wrote: post #286
graeme wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly is the bull case for bitcoin? I have not seen it clearly explained. I’ve got an open mind. In more specific terms you mentioned the unbanked. How does crypto solve the problems that leave them unbanked?

Bitcoin unleashes a million possibilities and overall guides the market. Check out Ethereum, Polkadot and Cardano if you want to see a real use case - Until then the usecase for bitcoin is the same as gold. But one day Bitcoin will pour it's 'Gold' Into the broader crypto market.

The unbanked aren't using gold either.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#353

Post by ddtaylor »

GeneralTspoon wrote: post #310
ddtaylor wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone can send or receive cryptocurrency without third party authorization.

True. But you can’t really buy anything with it. Which means you need to cash out to fiat $$$. And then you need 3rd party authorisation while jumping through all the KYC hoops.

PayPal accepts cryptocurrencies now, so I don't think it's fair to say you can't buy anything with it. Also there are decentralized marketplaces like OpenBazaar, which are still pretty new too.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#354

Post by scsilver »

xiphias2 wrote: post #137
deadalus wrote: post #25

Soon, a nation might realistically buy $100 B + of bitcoin and declare it a national currency.

Lots of countries are already putting Bitcoin in their pension fund, but keeping it secret. Microstrategy's institutional interview series had some interesting insider information about it without naming the countries themselves.

Do you have a link?

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#356

Post by cdiddy2 »

febeling wrote: post #219
exabrial wrote: post #3

Legitimizing Bitcoin more than offsets the environmental benefits of electric vehicles.

Bitcoin miners use surplus energy in remote places with lots of thermal or hydroelectric power. Remote China and Iceland. This electricity often can't be put to any other use anyway. The price of energy is probably enough to ensure this. Besides, the cost of maintaining Bitcoin has to be compared with holding up a fiat currency empire like the US. This requires lots of military, suppression of democracy and generally…

Bitcoin mining is also helping to end gas flaring in the US. Instead of just burning fuel, use it to run a mining farm https://www.crusoeenergy.com/news-and-media/2019/12/8/bloomb...

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#357

Post by heidar »

altcognito wrote: post #283
febeling wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin miners use surplus energy in remote places with lots of thermal or hydroelectric power. Remote China and Iceland. This electricity often can't be put to any other use anyway. The price of energy is probably enough to ensure this. Besides, the cost of maintaining Bitcoin has to be compared with holding up a fiat currency empire like the US. This requires lots of military, suppression of democracy and generally…

> This electricity often can't be put to any other use anyway. This is false. If there is surplus electricity, prices would drop, and you could expand availability. Government, especially the Chinese government is more than capable of shaping market demand. Furthermore, you could displace existing coal based electrical demand in the country. The value of currency comes from trust that you manage it well, not from the…

Iceland definitely has surplus energy. There's been ideas to lay a cables to mainland Europe to export it since it's going to waste at the moment.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#358

Post by graeme »

rax0m wrote: post #313
graeme wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly is the bull case for bitcoin? I have not seen it clearly explained. I’ve got an open mind. In more specific terms you mentioned the unbanked. How does crypto solve the problems that leave them unbanked?

Graeme I've got the perfect article for you [1]. [1]: https://vijayboyapati.medium.com/the-bullish-case-for-bitcoi... Please let me know what you think

Thanks. It didn’t seem very focussed. One of the major thesis is that all currencies follow four steps to adoption as a medium of exchange. For this they cite Jevons’ and his discussion of gold. And indeed, Jevons said gold followed those four steps.

But I looked at the source text and saw Jevons said gold was an exception to the rule in that it developed as a currency late in the cycle.

“ The use of esteemed articles as a store or medium for conveying value may in some cases precede their employment as currency.”

The author has made a basic error in their major thesis. And they still haven’t shown why bitcoin needs to have a sky high value.

The other half of the essay is describing ratings for different types of currencies. But this is description, not argument for why it must rise in value.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#359

Post by nickflood »

burkaman wrote: post #318
febeling wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin miners use surplus energy in remote places with lots of thermal or hydroelectric power. Remote China and Iceland. This electricity often can't be put to any other use anyway. The price of energy is probably enough to ensure this. Besides, the cost of maintaining Bitcoin has to be compared with holding up a fiat currency empire like the US. This requires lots of military, suppression of democracy and generally…

Energy grids are very big, and are planned very intentionally. Renewable energy produced in remote places is often used to power far away cities. It's very unlikely that a consistent energy source capable of powering a large bitcoin mine would not be integrated into the grid if the mine wasn't there. Here's some further reading: https://www.wired.com/story/bitcoins-climate-impact-global-c... https://www.cell.com/joul…

Energy transports costs are non-negligible. In fact, in Europe I pay more for the grid transfer (~0.25/kwh) than generation (0.06/kwh).

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#360

Post by bitxbitxbitcoin »

ianhawes wrote: post #347
rzodkiew wrote: post #338

Bitcoin is a mystery to me. Somehow it's hailed as revolutionising the economy, by replacing currency with a worse kind of currency. It feels like this is where all the "how to get rich quick" book writers and other hustle bros went and created one giant financial pyramid, which works in quite simple way: - buy bitcoin - tell everyone around how revolutionary it is, so they buy it and what you holding increases in va…

Bitcoin has revolutionized the black market economy.

Bitcoin has definitely done that but more importantly it has revolutionized the Shadow Economy - which is a lot larger than most people realize.
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