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Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

nohello.net

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Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#351

Post by fragmede »

rvanmil wrote: post #244
jethro_tell wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, it can also be a privacy thing. Sometimes I want to validate that my chat is not going to got onto a presenters screen somewhere.

This is a serious issue with the massive increase in video calls and screen sharing (and people being oblivious to or not caring about this). Not just chat but also email notifications with previews. This has become something I actively consider before communicating by text instead of calling someone. It would be great if teams, zoom etc could automatically and by default prevent any notifications from popping into a…

FWIW, OS X has a do not disturb toggle for this very reason. It's slightly hidden, but easily found with Google. That many people don't bother, is just how people are :/

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#352

Post by fragmede »

tuwtuwtuwtuw wrote: post #108
hedora wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I use slack in a web browser, and don’t give it permission to display notifications. I wish there was a way to permanently disable the “you have disabled notifications” prompts though.

Hmm I just disabled notifications in the normal slack client. Not sure why you would use the web browser?

It's not that notifications can't be disabled by clicking a few extra buttons, it's that those extra buttons are outside the usual workflow. Going into presentation mode in Keynote/Powerpoint/Google Slides doesn't also go into the slack client and disable them, nor does it for other programs that pop up notifications (eg skype, windows update/app store updater), and why should it? Keeping slack confined to the web browser sets this boundary neatly, so long as you don't also allow the web page to display notifications (which chrome will do if you let it).

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#353

Post by JoeAltmaier »

athriren wrote: post #270
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes text chat tools have too little engagement. I worked on a startup called Sococo (still exists; pivoted to be a WebRTC clone) that used a map. You could see each little bobblehead on the map, either in their office, in a conference room, in a break room, with our without their headset on. You clicked your guy into the room to conference with people in that room. If you didn't want to be bothered, you put your bobb…

i am confused. the explainer video looks like what you describe, how has sococo changed?

We used to support millisecond connect times, no squelching (everybody talked at any time), 100 folks in a conference, unlimited (thumbnail) videos and screen shares, always-on client that lived in your tool bar.

They went WebRTC which means Chrome. So its a browser page, takes up real estate, requires the right version of the browser, doesn't integrate with your desktop controls (audio, video) tightly, has ~1 second connect times, limits to half a dozen people tops, one video at a time. Which doesn't seem terrible until you click into a meeting and the voices come in one at a time over many seconds.

So large parts of the 'frictionless' are gone. You want to share something, get it to the right page, then draw attention to it - there's moderator gatekeeping, one-at-a-time rules.

Instead of everybody sharing whatever they liked, more than one share per person, all set up so anybody could look at anything they wanted without some moderator orchestrating it. You want to go back and look at Lucy's spreadsheet while Alice is talking thru her presentation? Just click on it, then click back into the presentation later.

We miss it.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#354

Post by signal11 »

eganist wrote: post #131
signal11 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For immediate replies I’d usually use “you there?” or “free for a quick chat?”. The naked greeting is just begging to get ignored.

The linked page advocates against these on the same premise, which is my primary challenge with it. It ignores urgency.

To be fair, I’d use “you there?” with coworkers I know, and who know me. Since I don’t usually begin by saying hi, they know I’m actually looking for them immediately.

And I can also use the phone if it’s really urgent.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#355

Post by unabst »

unabst wrote: post #233

The proper response to "hello" is just "hello". I was annoyed at first, but when I saw the phone of one of the kids that kept doing it, I saw his message app had 1283 unread messages. They basically can't keep up with each other, and "hello" is a way of inserting yourself in the queue. That's them calling. You not answering is you not picking up. So ya, ignore it too if you want. Communication guidelines are necessar…

edit for the record:

> You'll offend them...

If you encounter someone oversensitive, millineal or otherwise, you'll offend them...

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#356

Post by satisfice »

There is no problem saying “hi” in a chat. This is an example of a completely imagined general social problem, generated from the social anxiety of one guy.

It’s like TDD: somebody finds a way they like to work and then elevates that to a moral imperative for all.

Feel free to say “hi” to me in Slack. I take it to mean that you would like to have a conversation, when I am free. If you don’t want me to ping you in that way, then I will adapt to you. Just don’t claim your protocol is objectively better. It’s not.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#357

Post by satisfice »

kempbellt wrote: post #134
jasode wrote: post #33

>People who do this are generally trying to be polite by not jumping right into the request, like one would in person or on the phone - and that's great! Different people have different reasons but I notice that many people that do a naked "hi" / "hey" are trying to see if the receiver is present for an immediate reply. In other words, the sender deliberately wants a synchronous instead of asynchronous convo. They do…

This is a common theme in my workplace. Especially with everyone working remote and odd hours these days. We use both email and Slack, but most conversations tend to be asynchronous regardless and I frequently wonder why we even have an instant messenger. That said, I find that even if a message is asynchronous, it is much easier to track conversation flow via slack than email. Reply chains and indentations get messy…

Although I am an advocate of the “just say hi” school of IM, your message above is a constructive way of explaining how you’d like me to interact with you.

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#358

Post by fragmede »

fchu wrote: post #170
dfboyd wrote: post #39

I am the original author of the document this document was based on. It was an internal Wiki page at Google written when I was an SRE. After I wrote the original page, someone put up an internal shortlink at "go/nohello". After I left Google, someone took the Wiki page content and [illegally, since it was Google confidential, simply from being on the internal Wiki], and put it up on the net at "nohello.com". The link…

There was a "go/yeshello" to provide the opposing argument, and later a "go/onlyhello" which is obviously the correct answer

Is there also an "Only Zuul" response, or is that not the Google way?

( https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/there-is-no-dana-only-zuul )

Re: Please don't say just hello in chat (2013)

#359

Post by lwhi »

andersco wrote: post #10
lwhi wrote: post #6

How about people choose for themselves? Feels that one person's annoyance is another's wish. I don't see why someone's invented manifesto should be used as a guide for everyone.

Except you are imposing your “manifesto” on others by forcing an extra response.

Really. What? A manifesto of free choice??
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