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EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

eu-inc.org

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Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#341

Post by zajio1am »

traceroute66 wrote: post #214
ExoticPearTree wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> majority of population of any given country doesn't emigrate ever, even inside EU where it would be extremely easy Because unlike the US, we don't speak the same language. If there would have been a real push to have a common EU language since its inception, we would have been more mobile and more US like. But no...

> Because unlike the US, we don't speak the same language. The majority of Europeans, and especially those of recent generations speak incredibly good English. Most Europeans speak 2–3 languages anyway, so there is always a common language to be found. No need for one to be forced on you.

Common language works for employment and business, but then you go to government bureau (or want to fill government form) and they will insist on official language.

That is why english as secondary official language would be beneficial.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#342

Post by goldenarm »

embedding-shape wrote: post #334
goldenarm wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[deleted]

> The grassroot movement is from https://proposal.eu-inc.org So correct me if I had way too little coffee, but that subdomain is under eu-inc.org meaning eu-inc.org is in fact the grassroot movement then? I don't understand the complaint, seems to be the right people? You're mad about that they also sell hats?

Apologies, misred that part, but I maintain the rest of my argument.

This is unofficial, pushing for merch, 5 lines of info page, and should not have replaced a post about more detailed news reports.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#343

Post by fhennig »

bluecalm wrote: post #328

EU like making new regulation. There are simpler steps to make doing business here easier: -force banks to respect EU free trade union and stop them from discriminating EU citizens and companies who are not citizens -stop abuse when it comes to currency conversion rates -raise VAT-free threshold to something that doesn't catch very small companies, 200k EUR in sales to EU would be a good start (currently it's 10k) -f…

This is the way. Refactor the law.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#344

Post by miki123211 »

academia_hack wrote: post #168

It's inordinately difficult and expensive to start an LLC or SA in some EU countries. It's even difficult and expensive to _stop_ an LLC and dissolve it. Huge amount of risk and cost on founders and a huge distraction from running a business. I think that EU-Inc _could_ be an improvement, but it needs to avoid the committee laundry list of ideas/requirements/form fields that plagues the EU startup ecosystem. My worry…

I think what's even more important is that the costs for founding and maintaining such an LLC should scale with revenue, including scaling to 0.

In many EU countries, you still have to pay social security and/or health insurance, even if your company brings in no revenue. This isn't supposed to be a problem, as you're not really supposed to officially start a business unless you cross specific revenue thresholds. However, that doesn't work in practice if you're offering your services online, as many payment gateways in Europe will not deal with non-business accounts.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#345

Post by layer8 »

xinayder wrote: post #301
tggycom wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a pretty good TL;DR on their "In-Depth Proposal" site: https://proposal.eu-inc.org/TL-DR-14d076fd79c581959325c8e52d...

Thanks, but from a quick glance I couldn't find it on the homepage. Also, it's a Notion document, they could instead just write all of these points on their landing page? It reveals too much that this is actually done by amateurs. Heck, even the most basic business courses I took at a European uni show that this is NOT how you want to attract potential customers or investors.

> couldn't find it on the homepage

It’s the first link on the home page (“in-detail proposal”). One would presume anyone interested in what EU-INC is to read the first section titled “WHAT IS EU–INC”.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#346

Post by sam_lowry_ »

embedding-shape wrote: post #77
sam_lowry_ wrote: post #75

EU's strength is in diversity, and von der Leyen is set on killing that. US tech companies won not because EU is diverse, but because they had access to more money and could undermine all competition by dumping prices. Even before Google, there was Microsoft and it's tacit acceptance of "piracy".

> EU's strength is in diversity, and von der Leyen is set on killing that. I feel like it's important to specify "diversity" and not just use it as a catch-all. I don't believe the strength of the EU is in diversity of how companies are implemented and run across the union, it's the diversity of culture, mindset and people that is the strength, and that can be represented inside companies, even if the way of setting…

Diversity of rules also. And a sane amount of inefficiency and contradictions.

That's how we will build a truly resilient system.

Don't forget that the most efficient state was the Third Reich, closely followed by the Soviet Union.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#347

Post by jcmartinezdev »

lnsru wrote: post #222
jcmartinezdev wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I should have taken another road considering the size of my operations, unfortunately I was wrongly advised when starting up, I spent 1k with a Steuerberatung for advice on what was the proper structure for me, and still… I think they just adviced me the option that was gonna cost me the most to operate. Lesson learned I guess!

I visited many lectures about business at the university, participated at Munich business plan competitions and all the time holding structure GmbH owning other GmbH was the best solution. The reality is that this is best solution for medium enterprises, for the bootstrapped start it does not matter. If I can’t take off as crappy Gewerbe the expensive holding will not help me either. Learning was not free. My feeling…

Some tax consultants are very shady, and some are really arrogant. I'm currently looking for one as we had some disagreements on pricing with my previous one, and many won't even take me due to my volume, or maybe because I ask to speak English, idk...

But sometimes I feel they are doing me a favor by taking my company, rather than me feeling like I'm hiring them as a service.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#348

Post by seec »

academia_hack wrote: post #168

It's inordinately difficult and expensive to start an LLC or SA in some EU countries. It's even difficult and expensive to _stop_ an LLC and dissolve it. Huge amount of risk and cost on founders and a huge distraction from running a business. I think that EU-Inc _could_ be an improvement, but it needs to avoid the committee laundry list of ideas/requirements/form fields that plagues the EU startup ecosystem. My worry…

They won't be able to solve the problem. The only reason all those roadblocks exist is to control/regulate everything in a way to ensure the maximum possible taxation. At the same time, bureaucrats get to justify their existence, pretending to do meaningful work while they only take from productive people.

You can't even say they manage to regulate actual problems; they only reinforce the big players. The cookie consent banner nonsense and ongoing legal fight with Apple (and GAFAM in general) didn't bring anything of value to end consumers.

Cookies haven't disappeared; they have just become a major annoyance that you have to spend a lot of time clicking on and tracking hasn't been reduced, quite the contrary. The iPhone is still a locked-down device, with Apple maintaining a monopoly on software access as well as repairability (their repair program is such a joke that they should be tried for contempt if the EU actually had any power).

Bureaucracy is just cancer, and the EU is fully metastasized; there is not much that can improve until a major failure happens.

If you want to create a business, you have to pay the bureaucracy before you even make a single cent. Business has become more profitable to the government than the actual business owners; those thriving are the big ones who can afford to play the lobbying game and engage in regulatory capture and offload most of the cost on the taxpayers while profiting overseas.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#349

Post by the_mitsuhiko »

askonomm wrote: post #284
_petronius wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is true of all contract notarization in Germany (even when buying a house, jesus that is a slog), and although it is a bendy-banana level silly thing that people focus on, isn't actually the biggest problem in company founding here. MUCH more problematic is unfavorable tax rules making equity compensation difficult, capital requirements, legal/notary fees, and an investor class that is notoriously skittish. If y…

That's crazy. Notarization in Estonia can be done entirely online using a digital signature, just like everything else here is done (including voting, getting married, getting divorced, filing taxes, opening/closing a company, etc). From all I hear Germany is still stuck in the 90s for some reason.

I can also listen to a notary online in Austria. I just absolutely do not want to have the notary involved in the first place.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#350

Post by patates »

hvb2 wrote: post #262
patates wrote: post #257

Can you guys please somehow involve Switzerland too? I'm thinkng about moving there and my German employer is like, "No! Even France would be extremely hard, Switzerland is plain impossible for payroll!". Dude come on, I know they're not in the EU but like, there it feels like practically the same country if you don't mind the loveable accent and the crazy prices in another currency :)

Before you move there, for fun, look into what it would take to buy a house there :)

It's impossible here, triple impossible there, so still the same price from my perspective.
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