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Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

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Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#341

Post by kcplate »

mindslight wrote: post #328
kcplate wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is the reality, The actions Trump is taking regarding immigration enforcement are definitely consistent with the platform he ran on. None of this should be a shock to anyone. It’s not like Trump was an “unknown quantity”. Trump was still elected despite every thing we knew about him, how he managed the country, and what he wanted to do. I did not vote for him (not ever). I suspect many folks here did not vote fo…

First, this has very little to do with any sort of mandate for immigration enforcement. Immigration is being used as a pretext to deploy revanchist terror squads that are attacking all of civil society, as we've seen with the murder of this American citizen mother. And yes, people should have seen this coming when they voted for him. But this is not what he openly campaigned on at all. Second, winning an election doe…

> Then surely you can agree that labeling this regime as unrepentant murderers of American mothers is a good way of building broad opposition from people who might otherwise think it doesn't concern them, yes?

No. In fact I think jumping to conclusions, exaggerating, trying to use a tragedy to your advantage, obfuscation, and outright lying to try and manipulate public sentiment is perhaps the WORST way to try and move that needle.

Because what happens is what is happening now, more and more information trickles out and when that some of that info runs contrary to your narrative, people realize you have been trying to manipulate them and you lose your credibility. It creates reasonable doubt to all accounts about the situation and people simply reject it as evidence of anything.

We have seen first hand what the “don’t trust your lying eyes” approach has achieved…it’s achieved a second Trump administration.

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#342

Post by ethersteeds »

gorgoiler wrote: post #182
metadope wrote: post #166

Militia on our streets without discipline or uniforms. That's what caused this tragedy. The administration early on made the decision to allow/ require ICE agents to wear whatever tactical gear they had, along with masks, and authorized/ required an intentional lack of insignia. The lack of a uniform and insignia is a real problem for ordinary Americans. We're used to subjecting ourselves to authority. We're willing…

That’s a really interesting observation. If ICE field policy allows or even requires employee anonymity then, as a thought experiment, imagining them all in hockey masks helps emphasize everything that’s wrong with such a policy. I can think of even more inflammatory examples of face coverings, of course.

That's already happened:

https://lataco.com/federal-immigration-agents-halloween-mask...

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#343

Post by nobody9999 »

Sam713 wrote: post #281
kcplate wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a zoomed in and slowed down video circulating that shows after the driver was told to exit the vehicle that they reversed the vehicle first and then placed the car into drive (when the LEO was directly in front of her car). The driver hit the accelerator hard enough that the tires spun before they finally gained traction and moved the vehicle forward towards the officer. The velocity in which the vehicle beg…

If you watch the close up video from the 7 o’clock angle, you can clearly see that the tires don’t spin out by looking at the speed of the rims. Furthermore, imagine yourself in a situation where an aggressive, masked, armored, and armed person is trying to pull your door open while screaming in your face. You’re in full fight or flight mode, tunnel vision, scared, and confused. At this same time, unbeknownst to the…

I'd add that since, as ICE claims, Ms. Good had already been non-violently interacting with them, they had the opportunity to note the license plate and, if they felt criminal charges for obstructing their operations were appropriate, they could just go to her (nearby) house and arrest her later.

There was absolutely no reason for the attempt to pull her out of her car, and even less for escalation to use deadly force and, IIUC, DOJ guidelines and DHS policies[1] back that up.

This was an execution, not a law enforcement officer "defending" himself. That the decision was made in the heat of the moment doesn't make it any less an execution.

What's more, shooting peaceful protestors (cf. First Amendment[0]) is illegal on its face:

"Congress shall make no law...prohibiting...the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.*"

[0] https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/first_amendment

[1] https://apnews.com/article/ice-minneapolis-police-rules-shoo...

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#344

Post by [deleted] »

kcplate wrote: post #308
mindslight wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you do not get to tone police the word "murder" from everyone rightfully outraged with an above-it-all appeal to "impartial" but narrow legal definitions. We all know the legal system has been thoroughly corrupted, and there is the good chance this murderer will not actually be criminally charged and convicted of any types of legally-defined murder. This does not matter - in the eyes of We The People this is fuck…

> will not actually be criminally charged and convicted of any types of legally-defined murder. Yes, that is my point. What you consider a corrupt legal system, I call one that tries to protect people who are accused of a crime until they are proven guilty. It’s not “guilty until proven innocent”…its the other way around. > This does not matter - in the eyes of We The People this is fucking Murder. And the emotion he…

[deleted]

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#345

Post by FireBeyond »

mrtksn wrote: post #229
tim333 wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The things you talk of are either legal such as insulting people, or failed such as riots trying to overturn an election. This is different.

Lots of convicted criminals were pardoned already. People with connection to January 6 United States Capitol attack are all pardoned, some got promoted. There's something going on with Ghislaine Maxwell's situation too. US just abducted the president of a sovereign country and international law no longer means anything too. The president himself is also a convict. He is also implicated with many sexual assaults(alleg…

> People with connection to January 6 United States Capitol attack are all pardoned

Hah, many of them have been hired by ICE since.

> The president himself is also a convict.

Funnily enough, Florida made an exemption for him that allowed him to vote, despite their laws against convicted felons voting. They decided that since he had only been found guilty, and not sentenced, that he was not, yet, a convicted felon.

I wonder how many other people in Florida in the same situation could vote, or whether they'd be laughed at.

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#346

Post by FireBeyond »

cogman10 wrote: post #256
tim333 wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it may be different because firstly it's clearly murder or an unlawful shooting if you watch the video, and secondly because being shot by a masked officer for trying to drive down the road could happen to pretty much any American so I imagine they'll complain. That doesn't apply to the Jan 6th people or Maxwell - it's not part of people's everyday life.

I really hope you are right, but I fear you aren't. The conservative media bubble has already congealed on "She was trying to run over everyone and deserved to be shot". If someone wants to believe that ICE is the good guys and people protesting ICE are bad, they'll be pretty quick to adopt any narrative that will justify the actions of ICE. You can see that in this very thread. This might sway a few people, but I re…

> The conservative media bubble has already congealed on "She was trying to run over everyone and deserved to be shot".

Trying to? Trump already posted that she DID run him over and he was hospitalized for it.

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#347

Post by silexia »

jacquesm wrote: post #316
mindslight wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I've observed solipsistic entitlement blaming everyone else while performing zero self-reflection is a core tenet of "MAGA". It's why boomers are attracted to it like flies to a rotting animal - they were promised everything for buying into the system and had the good life for "working hard", so if someone cannot repeat their "success" (nb. everything bubble) then it must be that person's own fault.

They're going to do (and are already doing) a lot of damage on the way to their final resting place.

[flagged]

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#348

Post by jacquesm »

cogman10 wrote: post #256
tim333 wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it may be different because firstly it's clearly murder or an unlawful shooting if you watch the video, and secondly because being shot by a masked officer for trying to drive down the road could happen to pretty much any American so I imagine they'll complain. That doesn't apply to the Jan 6th people or Maxwell - it's not part of people's everyday life.

I really hope you are right, but I fear you aren't. The conservative media bubble has already congealed on "She was trying to run over everyone and deserved to be shot". If someone wants to believe that ICE is the good guys and people protesting ICE are bad, they'll be pretty quick to adopt any narrative that will justify the actions of ICE. You can see that in this very thread. This might sway a few people, but I re…

You can see it happening right here in this thread.

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#349

Post by jacquesm »

fjfaase wrote: post #91
mickle00 wrote: post #49

https://www.reddit.com/r/UnderReportedNews/comments/1q6to5j/... HuffPost has obtained a video of a physician trying to give medical care to the woman shot and killed by ICE agents today, and not being allowed to go near her. The ICE agents claim there are medics on site, but witnesses scream that there are no medics presentExtensively reported

That makes those ICE officers complicent to her death, because they had no ground for stopping the physician, who might have saved her.

They were accomplices long before that.

Re: Minneapolis driver shot and killed by ICE

#350

Post by jacquesm »

mickle00 wrote: post #85
baubino wrote: post #78

I’m not seeing this discussed very much but Minnesota governor Tim Walz has issued an order to prepare the state’s National Guard: > “To Minnesotans, on the National Guard, they’re there to protect you and protect your constitutional rights,” Walz said. “These are our neighbors. They don’t wear masks. They don’t bust in from somewhere else. They’re not here to cause hassles to you or what we saw today, the tragedy.”…

absolutely the right move to defend the people

What makes you so sure that will be the outcome? I'd love to see ICE being shown up by heavily outfitted NG but I rather suspect that that will not be what happens.
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