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The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

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Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#341

Post by wyre »

john_the_writer wrote: post #313
notatoad wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in a simple world, a web browser is a tool that is used by an end-user, and so end-users should be the ones paying for it. whether that's directly as paid software, or indirectly as part of purchasing a device that has the software installed on it.

gha.. Another subscription based app. I can see it now: 2.99/month. Also we already have browsers pre-installed. Safari and IE(or what ever it's called these days) There's no call to advance these though. Chrome has profiles. That alone makes it a winner for my use case.

Safari also has profiles…

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#342

Post by m4rtink »

guywithahat wrote: post #330
bearjaws wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The mere existence of a competitor is not the spirit of antitrust. Look at what Google does with Chrome and how it harms the internet, they literally just disabled an ad blocker and then offered a new tier of ad free Youtube for $8 a month. Then think about the power it gives them for tracking, remember they tried to replace tracking cookies with their own standard?

The counterpoint would be anyone can fork Chrome and put an adblocker back in (ie Brave). I worry as part of Google, chrome is just an open source project with profit as a secondary motive, while as it’s own company they’ll probably try to make it more profitable and it’ll become worse and closed down.

That's the same argument as with Android - its open source, anyone can fork it and change whatever they don't like!

And its flawed in the same way - first its not fully open source (IIRC Crhome has some proprietary bits that are not in Chromium, same with Android+Google Play services vs AOSP) but good luck maintaining your fork for any length of time!

Google is in full control of both Android and Chromium with all decisions happening behind closed doors with zero leverage for anyone from the outside to influence those decisions. So as with Manifest v3 now and many similarly bad decisions for Android, once Google selects a course, it will be harder and harder over time to keep your changes if you still want the end result to look like what the users will see as Chrome/Android.

And I would say with a browser the pressure to update would be even greater & thus its even harder to keep any signifficant custom changes.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#343

Post by timeflex »

tester756 wrote: post #331
kweingar wrote: post #320

Here's something I don't understand. If you want to switch your search engine for Safari on iOS, you open Settings, tap Safari, tap Search Engine, and tap your preferred search engine. Not many users do this, and the conclusion is that the default has an unfair advantage. If you want to make Chrome your desktop browser, you open the default browser, search for Chrome, click the correct result, download the installer,…

On Android Chrome is preinstalled and cannot be uninstalled

On Windows 11, Edge is preinstalled and can't simply be removed either. Furthermore, it constantly bugs you about if you're sure you don't want to enable their recommended settings, which ends up re-enabling all the analytics/rewards/etc.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#344

Post by paulryanrogers »

stainablesteel wrote: post #288
maxclark wrote: post #132

First I don't believe this is an effective remedy to break up a Google monopoly, but I have no influence on the DOJ. I'm curious though, if Google can no longer pay browsers for search engine traffic what is the business model that will sustain development and advancement in the space? How does a non Google owned Chrome support itself and continue development? What happens to all the applications that rely on Chrome…

is there a better way of breaking up the google monopoly?

First I'd separate Google Search from everything else. Then the ad marketplace business. Then YouTube. The others are weak enough they could coexist in one organization IMO.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#345

Post by alex_abt »

asdfman123 wrote: post #163

At this point, tech's major competitors are overseas. Never thought I'd be making this argument, but does breaking up the search monopoly help America or up and comers?

Who does preventing abusive behaviour benefit? Those currently being abused.

But doesn't that make room for someone else to come in and be abusive? Yes and we have the tools to prevent that, if necessary.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#346

Post by adrianmonk »

john_the_writer wrote: post #313
notatoad wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in a simple world, a web browser is a tool that is used by an end-user, and so end-users should be the ones paying for it. whether that's directly as paid software, or indirectly as part of purchasing a device that has the software installed on it.

gha.. Another subscription based app. I can see it now: 2.99/month. Also we already have browsers pre-installed. Safari and IE(or what ever it's called these days) There's no call to advance these though. Chrome has profiles. That alone makes it a winner for my use case.

I don't want another subscription-based app, but out of all the software that brings me actual significant value on a daily basis, a web browser is very near the top of the list.

Even though getting it free (as I do right now) is nice, $36/year seems justifiable.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#347

Post by grapesodaaaaa »

kweingar wrote: post #337
ethbr1 wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you want to switch your search engine for Safari on iOS... I can set Kagi as the default search engine on iOS? Because last I checked, Apple hardcoded their list of options.

That's a very good point. Mobile OS vendors should allow for user-defined search engines the way that desktop browsers do.

In principle I agree, but there needs to be an “old person mode.” The number of times I’ve uninstalled malware on my relatives’ computers is astounding.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#348

Post by EE84M3i »

ok123456 wrote: post #309
EE84M3i wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google already monitizes Chrome with chrome enterprise (premium) and similar offerings for education where Chrome OS is used extensively. Schools and enterprises have little choice but to buy these to use chrome securely, and they could easily move even more of the management features behind these paid plans. They also already charge to be an extension developer and could easily charge much more.

Chrome for Enterprise is an add-on for Google Workspaces. How does that work if the companies are separate?

That's true but most of the features are for the chrome management panel or client side, which would all presumably be separated from workspace and inherited by the new company. They could then move features from the free tier into the premium tier to put pressure on enterprises and schools to pay.

There are some cross-cutting server side features for context aware access for google workspace and google cloud, which were inherited from beyondcorp enterprise, so those would presumably stay with the real google of course.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#349

Post by o999 »

kweingar wrote: post #320

Here's something I don't understand. If you want to switch your search engine for Safari on iOS, you open Settings, tap Safari, tap Search Engine, and tap your preferred search engine. Not many users do this, and the conclusion is that the default has an unfair advantage. If you want to make Chrome your desktop browser, you open the default browser, search for Chrome, click the correct result, download the installer,…

Antitrust goal is protect competition and prevent monopolies, Safari search and Bing market shares aren't in a position of a monopoly, unlike Google's (~79% of desktop search market share)

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#350

Post by makeitdouble »

timeflex wrote: post #343
tester756 wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On Android Chrome is preinstalled and cannot be uninstalled

On Windows 11, Edge is preinstalled and can't simply be removed either. Furthermore, it constantly bugs you about if you're sure you don't want to enable their recommended settings, which ends up re-enabling all the analytics/rewards/etc.

What it would take to get them punished again...

The edge situation is a mess for sure, and Microsoft seems to have such a perfect understanding of the current judiciary climate that they can't dance around the lines without any consequences.

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