341–350 of 434 posts
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I’m glad that my US constitutional rights cannot be abrogated by a supranational judicial system.
But they can still torture according to Scalia. It wouldn't violate the 8th Amendment unless you have been found guilty. Then it would be cruel punishment.
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I can ask it no clearer: Given that your counterfactual is an exceedingly rare edge case, why do you feel it is important to counter the valuable moral heuristic of "torture=bad"? What are you gaining by doing that?
If I said "All prime numbers are odd" I would not question what you gain by bringing up the example of 2.
This is the kind of stuff that probably makes some people’s job down the pipe easier and at the same time undermines the Western civilization. Make no mistake, no US citizen outside of the political class benefits from this or other atrocities. The exact same goes for the surveillance programs. Losing the moral high ground degrades the whole society. The whole anti establishment movement rallies around stuff like thi…
It's a very small step from this to disappearing and torturing dissidents at home. With The View calling for Tucker Carlson to be tried for treason by a military tribunal, I think we're approaching that point. Then when we get there and someone disappears (say, a colleague, a friend of a friend), some will think and even say "they must have done something". How do I know? Because that is what happened in Argentina du…
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These kinds of conversations always devolve. "Torture is bad and should be abolished". "Well, what about this other, very contrived situation where it's good?" You can use that non-sequitur to justify literally anything. "Murder, slavery and rape is bad". "Well, what about this situation where it did good?"
That's why law is hard. Even the contrived situations occur.
There are only people who inexplicably insist that a tortured non-sequitur is a pro-torture counterfactual.
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> look at the other UN member countries not signatories to the Rome Statute subject to the ICC: China, Iraq, Israel, Libya, Qatar, and Yemen That's far from a complete list. There are 193 UN members[1]; only 123 have made themselves subject to the ICC[2]. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Member_states_of_the_United_Na... 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/States_parties_to_the_Rome_Sta...
I never said it was a complete list. On the other hand you are not distinguishing countries that have signed but not yet ratified the treaty, leaving only 41 members. Of those 41 members feel free to highlight those countries which are shining examples of rule of law and human rights.
I could just as easily turn that argument around and say “why would the US want to sign onto an agreement that include countries like Jordan and Cambodia that have no rule of law”?
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> Wait, what? I'm American... South American, to be precise. Just to be precise, being American means you're from the United States of America. I don't call myself North American, for example. Neither does anyone else. When you introduce yourself you don't say "Hi I'm the_af and I'm from America". That would be confusing, unless you're actually from the United States. > The US as world police doesn't exactly fill me…
> Just to be precise, being American means you're from the United States of America. I don't call myself North American, for example. Neither does anyone else. When you introduce yourself you don't say "Hi I'm the_af and I'm from America". No, this is false. I call myself American. We're from the Americas. (North)American exceptionalism is bullshit. But my point is that disagreement over US policy and their role as w…
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It's a very small step from this to disappearing and torturing dissidents at home. With The View calling for Tucker Carlson to be tried for treason by a military tribunal, I think we're approaching that point. Then when we get there and someone disappears (say, a colleague, a friend of a friend), some will think and even say "they must have done something". How do I know? Because that is what happened in Argentina du…
You don't need hypothetical Tucker Carlson situations in a world where Julian Assange and Ed Snowden are alive. I live in the US now but I come from a third world country (Iran) where such atrocities are commonplace. And let me tell you. What is happening to Assange shows that when it matters, the intelligence community is above the law and not that different from those bizarre authoritarian regimes. It's just that t…
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I'm sure they will when US starts carpet bombing Canada's cities.
So the Middle East and South America is okay but Canada is off limits?
You don't ever see anything about the invasions of Grenada or Panama, let alone all the murk that the US does with Haiti, heck Puerto Rico is not even a state but a US Caribbean colony, the US used to torture the separatists leaders of Puerto Rico with Radiation
https://www.telesurenglish.net/news/50-years-since-Death-of-...
I am posting telesur purposely btw, if anyone else cares go read the wiki
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It's a very small step from this to disappearing and torturing dissidents at home. With The View calling for Tucker Carlson to be tried for treason by a military tribunal, I think we're approaching that point. Then when we get there and someone disappears (say, a colleague, a friend of a friend), some will think and even say "they must have done something". How do I know? Because that is what happened in Argentina du…
Excusing your whataboutism, it isn’t hard to argue he’s a foreign agent.
This is the kind of stuff that probably makes some people’s job down the pipe easier and at the same time undermines the Western civilization. Make no mistake, no US citizen outside of the political class benefits from this or other atrocities. The exact same goes for the surveillance programs. Losing the moral high ground degrades the whole society. The whole anti establishment movement rallies around stuff like thi…
It's a very small step from this to disappearing and torturing dissidents at home. With The View calling for Tucker Carlson to be tried for treason by a military tribunal, I think we're approaching that point. Then when we get there and someone disappears (say, a colleague, a friend of a friend), some will think and even say "they must have done something". How do I know? Because that is what happened in Argentina du…
These things not only „can happen“, they happened in the not too distant past - much less than a generation ago:
1. There is strong evidence that the CIA ran - and maybe still runs - black sites across Europe used to kidnap people and bring them to Afghanistan or Guantanamo for torture. 2. At least half of Germany used to be a socialist dictatorship until 1990. People disappeared on a regular basis - and those responsible for kidnapping, torturing and killing dissidents still live among us, as our neighbors, as businessmen or members of parliament.