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Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

economist.com

341–350 of 360 posts

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

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post #329
post #147

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I agree with the sentiment but based on the text of the ruling, I can't agree with the ruling itself [0]. Missing from your summary is: - "The applicant, Violeta-Sibianca Lăcătuş, is a Romanian national who was born in 1992 and lives in Bistrita-Nasaud (Romania)." - "In 2011 Ms Lăcătuş, who was unable to find work, began asking for charity in Geneva." Why was somebody who "lives in" Romania begging in Geneva? Would s…

Western European countries seem to be completely incompetent at deporting people. Illegal immigrants, terrorists, criminals, they fail to deport almost everyone.

I don't think you can simply deport EU member citizens from a EU state. From what I can understand at first glance it is only possible when the citizen has been sentenced for a heavy crime.

edit: Of course Geneva is not in the EU, but in many aspects the situation is similar.

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#342
post #330
post #63

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That sounds like a reasonable decision. After all advertisement is nothing but begging to increase the profit of the advertiser. If I really need to buy something, I'm sure I can do so without advertisement. Advertisement, be it some marketing phone call, someone offering me whatever subscription on the corridor of the mall, and ads making my phone browsing experience super slow are a much bigger nuisance to me than…

Your claim would make some sense (not much, but at least some) if companies were panhandling at the train station.

From the size of the billboards there I can see a connection.

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#343
post #338

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> As the advent of antipsychotics and antidepressants reduced their population, these hospitals were an obvious target for budget cuts throughout the 80s and 90s Do you have a source that shows that public funding for hospitals and treatments for mental health declined during this time period? From a quick search is seems it has risen considerably throughout the 80s to today. https://www.statista.com/statistics/25239…

Trump stomping on his predecessor's sand castle is not a new phenomenon. Patients be damned, Jimmy Carter giveth and The Gipper taketh away.[0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_Health_Systems_Act_of_1...

From your link:

> the Mental Health Systems Act supported and financed community mental health support systems

I'm missing something here.

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#344
post #273

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Exactly, it's not a choice. Also, I think the current method of making alcohol really expensive through levies is not working. It only makes homeless addicted people poorer and more likely to turn to crime. The rest of us don't give a shit how much it costs, we don't use much of it anyway. The price is never a factor in getting addicted or getting off it. All it is is the government profiteering of people who can't h…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vK7l55ZOVIc But no one likes the alternative, which is to say there is no more alcohol, because it's just another human being saying you can't have more of this that you crave.

When they can't kill their feelings with alcohol they will find something else. Substances or actions. Probably not something good.

I agree alcohol is a drug and should be treated as one.

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#345

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Integrating counselling and medical doctoring is a strange idea, and it's somewhat weird that it's even as much of a thing as it is. Drug-focused psychiatrists are certainly going to be a thing so long as med school is so costly and med schools conspire to keep the supply of doctors low.

> Integrating counselling and medical doctoring is a strange idea Why? It doesn't seem any different to me than surgery + physical therapy for a non-brain-oriented medical problem.

Right, and a surgeon doesn't serve as your physical therapist just like the psychiatrist doesn't serve as your talk therapist. They're different roles, even though they're both addressing the same part of your health.

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#346
post #333

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> Bothering others is not a human right. The ruiling doesn't mention bothering others. That was something you introduced to the conversation, just so you could dismiss it.

Roma begging in Europe is a lot more aggressive compared to the US where people usually just sit against the wall with a sign. They usually stop you from walking down the street and refuse to take no for an answer the first few times. And it repeats every single day if they set up near your work or apartment. It can also often be step 1 of a pickpocketing scam. Its not surprising that people were bothered enough to m…

That's helpful perspective. Thanks.

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's unrelated, people like that are not ready to function 'normally', they need a shelter, asylum, hospital. It's an emotional problem more than material.

There are other approaches to treating people with drug and alcohol addictions than trying to get them to quit. One is harm reduction. This has most famously been used to help people with IV drug addictions, in the form of safe injection sites. It can also be used for alcoholism: you provide a bar-like setting where people can go to get free drinks (rationed and served on a schedule by a trained server) and also soci…

I don't necessarily disagree, and have no expertise on the subject. But skip to any part of this (excellent) documentary about a 'wethouse' (basically what you describe, a place for homeless alcoholics to live, drink and socialise) and you'll see abject chaos, violence, misery at every turn. It's probably better than the streets, but not by much.

https://youtu.be/MF5wNsfKo84

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most meaningful comparison is CSA: NY is 22.5M LA is 18.7M https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_statistical_area

I think many people prefer the MSA definition over the CSA, CSA feels like a bit of a stretch in many of its definitions. Are San Jose and San Francisco one entity, or two? CSA says one, MSA says two.

Consider that someone who lives between them could have a 30 min. commute to a job in both. There's definitely a case to be made for some cases to use the concept that encompasses that.

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#349
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure the Romani would prefer to fix discrimination and generational poverty but you can do that while also asking people to not use their name as a curse word (and also it's not really being fixed).

In Western Europe there have been movements to avoid using the local equivalent of the term "gypsy", and these have seen some success. However, in the Balkan countries these movements have had little impact, even among the Roma themselves. There is a small Roma intelligentsia, university-educated and aware of those international trends, who welcomes the usage of "Roma (and Sinti)" instead of the traditional word. Amo…

They can say what they want but if their language is a close relative to Punjabi they are fools if they don't realize there are about 100 million people out there who understand them

Re: Finland has slashed homelessness; the rest of Europe is failing

#350

I'm in the US. I was homeless as a teenager (not by choice). I live adjacent to a major homeless community (not by design). My ex left our family to join the homeless community (she struggles with mh issues). I have some observations. We could sharply reduce homeless numbers here if we had in-patient mental health facilities (for non-wealthy), comprehensive housing aid and politically powerful job placement programs.…

Just an observation. The mental health system doesn’t have much capacity to begin with. Even for middle-class folk with insurance it can be very hard to get treatment. There is a shortage of mental health professionals which is projected to get worse. Psychiatrists are mostly doing medication management because that’s where they’re most effective. Following the path of getting treatment—everything including diagnosis…

Can confirm. Suffered some major trauma. I have money and insurance, and even I gave up on help.

Have my 15 minute appointment to get some ptsd drugs, and learn to push through.

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