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Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

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Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#341

Post by cr1895 »

mercer wrote: post #152
eecc wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure beats paying for a car, insurance, road tax, gasoline, parking... did I forget anything? Yeah, having your bike stolen sucks, particularly if on your way back home from a night at De School but whatever... still cheaper (and healthier and fun) Get it over, or you can go live a couple years in Rome and learn what it means to live in a hideous car-infested city.

How is De School? I've been meaning to check it out and I heard it's from the people that ran the club in the Trouw building, which I kind of liked by the (relatively) mediocre Amsterdam club standards.

I've only been once (for FourTet/Floating Points) but it was spectacular. Very good vibe downstairs; super dark/minimal light effects, excellent sound, diverse and respectful crowd, spacious. Except for all the broken glass. The concrete floor was absolutely strewn with shattered beer bottles.

The small open garden is really pleasant, though unfortunately it closes early (maybe 3-4am?). It's a nice respite from the steamy floor.

I like the art installations too.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#342

Post by lambdadmitry »

avar wrote: post #47

> If anything, having a tatty, battered old > bike affords more status as it attests to > a long and lasting love. As an Amsterdam resident: What a romantic characterization of our high crime rates! Yes, the reason I still ride a shitty old beater of a bike is definitely my long lasting love for that piece of shit, it's not because I know that if I buy anything fancy I'm going to have to never take my eyes off of it,…

I'm wondering how much of that crime can be attributed to the following circular thinking:

> the bike crime level is so high, no sense in buying half-decent bike

> no way I buy a lock that costs more than bike

> [the lock can be cut by bolt cutter in a few seconds]

> [the lock gets cut, the bike gets stolen]

> omg, they stole my bike! Gotta buy another cheap one

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#343

Post by TulliusCicero »

eeZah7Ux wrote: post #66
TulliusCicero wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bike infrastructure in most countries is generally very bad compared to car infrastructure, or even walking infrastructure. This leads to not many people cycling, which gives you a chicken and egg problem: few cyclists mean little political support for biking. For cars in the US it's the opposite: even when major cities get big enough to where cars clearly aren't scaling well anymore, cities are often reluctant to re…

No. The chicken and egg problem existed when cars where the new thing and roads where designed for people on feet, bikes, cable cars, trams and horses. Then car companies did a lot of lobbying.

You are correct, but that doesn't mean we don't have also have a chicken and egg problem now. The thing is that there's a lot less of a bike lobby in 2017 than there was a car lobby back in those days.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#344

Post by jdietrich »

revelation wrote: post #187
jdietrich wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The three-speed hub gears that are typical in the Netherlands are practically unknown over here in the UK. Even the cheapest bicycles will have a 27-speed triple setup with an extremely low bottom gear. Mountain bikes completely took over the market in the 1990s, with a lasting legacy for almost all styles of bicycle. A couple of cities are extremely challenging for cyclists (most notably Bristol) and we do have a fe…

That's not because the UK are so extremely hilly and adverse mountainous terrain (it's not) but because in car centric countries, shitty bike shaped objects sold in shops like WalMart dominate the market and what sells best to that audience that doesn't really actually use a bicycle? Cool looking mountain bikes with useless shocks and all the bells and whistles.

The mountain bike boom gave us the hybrid, which is an extremely useful bicycle - an upright bicycle with a rigid frame, wide-range gearing, efficient low-pressure slick tyres, plenty of clearance for mudguards and pannier rack bosses. It's a much more useful style of bicycle than the boom-era ten speed. The bike-shaped object is still around, but we now have a generation of much more savvy bike buyers.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#345

Post by gutnor »

belorn wrote: post #241
gutnor wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a tourist, this was weird, I nearly got mowed down a few times but because I was in the wrong and not paying attention. You quickly adapt and realized bike lanes are just as important to watch out for as vehicle lanes. You can also get mowed down in pedestrian area, on the pavement by impatient cyclist that don't like traffic jams and custom courtesy like stopping to let you cross a zebra crossing is non-existen…

This fear of cyclist seems very odd from my point of view since I often see strollers on bike lanes with parents that have no problem that bikes has to stop and go around them. I occasionally also see people in wheel chairs using the bike lane. The fear would make sense if all that caused yearly deaths by cycling crashing into toddlers and people, but its is surprisingly rare. I have yet to hear about a single case h…

Is lethality the only criteria that can justify fear ? My cyclist colleagues are constantly afraid of pedestrians ( reverse problem than Amsterdam, in London, where infrastructure is inconsistent and pedestrian quite oblivious of cyclists ), they drive on the open road and regularly reach 20 mph speeds. The assumption that because they are cyclist they can brake instantly is the main cause they bump into pedestrians. There are very little genuine accident ( like wet road marking ) with pedestrian, always problem that could be avoided by not stepping in front of a 90 kg mass cycling at over 15 mph.

Amsterdam was supposed to be the example of integration (pedestrian / cyclist / car ) done right. It wasn't, just that the position of power between cyclist and pedestrian was reversed compared to London: instead of entitled mum with a stroller in the bike lane, you get entitled cyclist that blaze through a pedestrian area ringing his bell and shouting rather than controlling his speed.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#346

Post by rmc »

cdnsteve wrote: post #84

Just came back from a week in Netherlands and stayed in Amsterdam. What a cool place to hang out and take in the sights. Cycling there is huge indeed. The big difference I noticed from Canada was the dedicated infrastructure they have in place. Dedicated cycling lanes everywhere, it's a proper form of transportation. As a tourist, this was weird, I nearly got mowed down a few times but because I was in the wrong and…

> I don't really see if implementing what they have because it's already built in.

Amsterdam, as city, is hundreds of years old. Bicycles weren't around then. They have had to put bike infrastructure in.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#347

Post by mercer »

piva00 wrote: post #335
mercer wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is De School? I've been meaning to check it out and I heard it's from the people that ran the club in the Trouw building, which I kind of liked by the (relatively) mediocre Amsterdam club standards.

I really like De School, went there for their Weekender during ADE and it was one of the best parties I've ever been to, good enough to compare to some days I had at Sisyphos in Berlin... Out of ADE my last time there was back in December, wasn't really fond of many clubs in Amsterdam but De School is definitely one of the best, definitely worth checking it out and I'm going again now in the end of June :)

I love Sisyphos so that's good news! I take it they don't have chickens running around at De School though?

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#348

Post by herbst »

ramy_d wrote: post #93
chrisseaton wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Surely it means nothing Well I guess it means that you can't leave your bike unlocked in parts of Amsterdam, which is a shame.

You can't leave your bike unlocked anywhere. Ever. At anytime. How come this isn't the initial reasoning? In fact, you can't leave anything unattended or not secured. This goes for cars, bikes, luggage, homes, i don't know what else.

I've lived in a 250 people Swiss mountain town with 500 bed tourism and nothing was locked ever.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#349

Post by scardine »

dmichulke wrote: post #328
scardine wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Brazil and commute by bicycle daily, 10.5 km each way (6.5 miles, mostly cycleways). Not without problems however: the air polution in Sao Paulo recommends against physical activities, the cycleways are of very questionable quality and the Pinheiros river stinks as hell. I can spot some capybaras (they are like giant guinea pigs) in the morning, have to dodge their excrement in the cycleway (they shit like…

Kudos, you are a brave man. From what I know from Florianopolis, moving on less than four wheels (including walking) is just plain dangerous unless you have a physically separated lane. I know several people who got injured and I see many white bikes attached to posts on the road as a sign of "someone on a bike lost his life here". Of course, the physically separate lane still has many wholes and occasionally a 30cm…

Well, I used to cummute by motorcycle before and yes, everything in Brazil is brutal, traffic is not an exception.

Two motorcycle riders die in in Sao Paulo EVERY SINGLE DAY on average - this statictic is not counting the ones that die a week later in the hospitals. There are more than 1 million motorcycles registered in the city (1 for every 10 citizens) but still a lot of meaningless deaths.

Previous mayor Haddad made a lot of bicycle lanes all over the city but they are of very poor quality, some are plain dangerous or are in areas where they are not used (poor planning).

That said, I would trade Sao Paulo by Florianopolis any day of the week - in Sao Paulo I'm 50 miles from the sea, in Florianopolis you can surf before the work.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#350

Post by funnyfacts365 »

krageon wrote: post #316
ZenoArrow wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "The problem is that the police have other stuff to do, and they might as well be pissing in the wind with the amount of bike theft here. They could do a huge crackdown, but that's unsustainable and after the crackdown we'll be right back to the same theft rate." How about using CCTV at bicycle locking points? Combined with satellite imagery it should be a relatively non-resource intensive way to catch the thiefs.…

Let's not turn Dutch cities into another example of the horrifying panopticon that UK cities have become.

Dude, they already are. Cameras everywhere
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