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Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

blog.kilocode.ai

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Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#331

Post by aeon_ai »

danaris wrote: post #326
aeon_ai wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a clear difference between "I have used these tools, tested their limits, and have opinions" and "I am consuming media narratives about why AI is bad" AI presently has a far lower footprint on the globe than the meat industry -- The US Beef industry alone far outpaces the impact of AI. As far as "work pillaging" - There is cognitive dissonance in supporting the freedom of information/cultural progress and sim…

> There's a clear difference between... There's also a clear difference between users of this site that come here for all types of content, and users who have "AI" in their usernames. I think that the latter type might just have a bit of a bias in this matter?

I'd be surprised if one needed to refer to my username to make a determination on me viewing the technology more optimistically, although I do chafe a tad at the notion that I don't come here for all types of content.

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#332

Post by aeon_ai »

jraph wrote: post #282
aeon_ai wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a clear difference between "I have used these tools, tested their limits, and have opinions" and "I am consuming media narratives about why AI is bad" AI presently has a far lower footprint on the globe than the meat industry -- The US Beef industry alone far outpaces the impact of AI. As far as "work pillaging" - There is cognitive dissonance in supporting the freedom of information/cultural progress and sim…

> consuming media narratives about why AI is bad That's quite uncharitable. I don't need to use it to make these points. While I might show a lack of perspective, I don't need to do X to reasonably think X can be bad. You can replace X with all sorts of horrible things, I'll let the creativity of the readers fill in the gap. > AI presently has a far lower footprint on the globe than [X] We see the same kind of argume…

It's not intended to be uncharitable - You clearly value many things I do (the world needs less attention-seeking, energy greedy shitty software).

I don't know how else one gets information and forms an opinion on the technology except for media consumption or hands-on experience. Note that I count "social media" as media.

My proposition is that without hands-on experience, your information is limited to media narratives, and it seems like the "AI is net bad" narrative seems to be the source of perspectives.

Skepticism is warranted, and there are a million ways this technology could be built for terrible ends.

But, I'm of the opinion that: A) The technology is not hype, and is getting better B) That it can, and will, be built -- Time horizon debatable. C) That for it to result in good outcomes for humanity, it requires good people to help shape it in its formative years.

If anything, more people like you need to be engaging it to have grounded perspectives on what it could become.

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#333

Post by paulhodge »

Aurornis wrote: post #222
sudhirj wrote: post #26

Did the Max plan ever promise unlimited anything? I’m on it, and I remember seeing and paying for 20x, not infinity. There is a case to be made that they sold a multiple and are changing x or rate limiting x differently, but the tone seems different from that.

I can’t find any indication it was ever sold as unlimited. It always had limits and those limits were not specified as concrete numbers. It’s amazing how much of the internet outrage is based on the idea that it was unlimited and now it’s not. The main HN thread yesterday was full of comments complaining about losing unlimited access. It’s so weird to watch people get angry about thinking they’re losing something the…

Yeah the outrage is a little artificial and definitely premature.

Some facts for sanity:

1- The poster of this blog article is Kilocode who makes a (worse) competitor to Claude Code. They are definitely capitalizing on this drama as much as they can. I’ve been getting hit by Reddit ads all day from Kilocode, all blasting Anthropic, with the false claim that their plan was "unlimited".

2- No one has any idea yet what the new limits will be, or how much usage it actually takes to be in the top 5% to be affected. The limits go into effect in a few days. We'll see then if all the drama was warranted.

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#334

Post by __MatrixMan__ »

epistasis wrote: post #303
__MatrixMan__ wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Loyalty is for henchmen.

I am loyal to my family and friends, business partners, and to those who I believe are fighting the good fight, as long as they continue the good fight. I do not consider myself a henchmen to any of them.

Loyalty is a conflict resolution tool. But when my relationships are such that nobody is pursuing contradictory goals to begin with, I find that it doesn't come up hardly at all.

On the rare occasion that it does, I try to circle back and mitigate the root cause so that I can resume a loyalty-free life thereafter.

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#336

Post by tom_m »

energy123 wrote: post #34
epistasis wrote: post #6

I'm trying to cancel my Claude plan right now, because mid-research I got hit with a one hour time out for the first time, and I realized just how little I need the "expensive" research stuff and just want basic language refinement and some basic augmented knowledge search to get more terms to search the web. And all that basic stuff gets cutoff when you hit some invisible barrier that you have no way of controlling…

Google and OpenAI have done similar things with their LLM offerings. Gemini Advanced offered 2.5 Pro with nearly unlimited rate limits, then nerfed it to 100/day. OpenAI silently nerfed the maximum context window of reasoning models in their Pro plan. Accompanying the nerf is usually a psy op, like nerfing to 50/day then increasing it to 100/day so the anchoring effect reduces the grievance. It's a smart ploy because…

Google tried to offer a free tier for students and people to TRY it. That's a LOT different because they were up front about limits.

You pay for Gemini by the token and you get the full firehose. It costs money, but less than Opus and it smokes that.

It just works. Gemini 2.5 Pro is the king of AI coding and literally everything else has to catch up.

Trust me, I can't wait until there's a model that can run locally that's as good...but for now there isn't.

Always just look at the token cost and get used the token economics. Go into it paying. You'll get better results. I think people thinking they were somehow cheating and getting away with something similar (or better) for $20/mo are in for a big surprise.

I don't know if I would say they should have known better of course. I think Anthropic and Cursor and Windsurf were hiding it a bit. Now it's all coming out into the open and I guess you know the saying, if it's too good to be true...

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#337

Post by tom_m »

epistasis wrote: post #54
energy123 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google and OpenAI have done similar things with their LLM offerings. Gemini Advanced offered 2.5 Pro with nearly unlimited rate limits, then nerfed it to 100/day. OpenAI silently nerfed the maximum context window of reasoning models in their Pro plan. Accompanying the nerf is usually a psy op, like nerfing to 50/day then increasing it to 100/day so the anchoring effect reduces the grievance. It's a smart ploy because…

I had been loyal, but am not any longer, so the ploy definitely did not work with me. I guess I'll move on to Gemini now, until I get sick of it. To the degree there is a moat, I do not think it will be effective at keeping people in. I had already been somewhat disillusioned with the AI hype, but now I am also disillusioned with the company who I thought was the best actor in the space. I am happy that there is unli…

You probably won't get sick of Gemini. Your wallet may need to get used to an adjustment though.

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#338

Post by myko »

atonse wrote: post #61
conartist6 wrote: post #32

"I firmly believe that AI will not replace developers, but a developer using AI will replace a developer who does not." Ugh, anyone who says that and really believes it can no longer see common sense through the hype goggles. It's just stupid and completely 100% wrong, like saying all musicians will use autotune in the future because it makes the music better. It's the same as betting that there will be no new invent…

I disagree. While there are developers that truly build new technology and invent novel solutions, the overwhelming majority of developers who are paid for their work daily do pretty mundane and boring software development. They are implementing business logic, building forms, building tables, etc. And AI already excels at building those sorts of things faster and with cleaner code. I’ve never once seen a model gener…

> and with cleaner code

I use AI pretty extensively and encourage my folks to use it as well but I've yet to see this come directly from an LLM. With human effort after the fact, sure, but LLMs tend to write inscrutable messes when left to their own devices.

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#339

Post by scraptor »

epistasis wrote: post #54
energy123 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google and OpenAI have done similar things with their LLM offerings. Gemini Advanced offered 2.5 Pro with nearly unlimited rate limits, then nerfed it to 100/day. OpenAI silently nerfed the maximum context window of reasoning models in their Pro plan. Accompanying the nerf is usually a psy op, like nerfing to 50/day then increasing it to 100/day so the anchoring effect reduces the grievance. It's a smart ploy because…

I had been loyal, but am not any longer, so the ploy definitely did not work with me. I guess I'll move on to Gemini now, until I get sick of it. To the degree there is a moat, I do not think it will be effective at keeping people in. I had already been somewhat disillusioned with the AI hype, but now I am also disillusioned with the company who I thought was the best actor in the space. I am happy that there is unli…

Interesting to see the definition of moat change from keeping other companies out to keeping your customers in.

Re: Stop selling “unlimited”, when you mean “until we change our minds”

#340

Post by theshrike79 »

piker wrote: post #289
theshrike79 wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TBH paying yearly for ANY LLM tool at this time is just pure insanity. The field is moving so fast that whatever was best 6 months ago is completely outdated. And what is top tier today, might be trash in a few months.

The second sentence is revealing. The creation of the 787 didn’t make the 747 “trash”.

You also couldn't just unsubscribe from the 747 and get a 787 a the same price.

Services are not the same thing as physical goods.

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