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Bullshit Jobs

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Re: Bullshit Jobs

#331

Post by Spooky23 »

groestl wrote: post #159
Jaruzel wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that these jobs are bullshit jobs, it's that commonly they are wrapped up in bullshit procedures . These procedures typically appear when there's an initiative to reduce costs. The easiest and cheapest way to employ an unskilled person to do a skilled job is to hand them a book of 'procedures' on their first day and say "Everything you need to do and know is in this Book". No time consuming cross-training re…

I think you're right, but I have a somewhat less dire view on this. I think that large companies optimize for a fundamentally different outcome than smaller companies, like startups. Large companies became large by applying a successful business model, something that startups are still lacking. If you have a working business model and stable cashflow, any change is potentially dangerous and can take down the company.…

Absolutely.

There are lots of products that are essentially exactly the same as they were years ago, which is great — change is often a bad thing for consumer products and tools. Typically the only value that innovative managers have in these companies is making the product incrementally cheaper and shittier. The value is that it makes room for quality competitors.

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#332

Post by wildmusings »

wastedhours wrote: post #318
wildmusings wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How nice, to leave students massively in debt so that the university can run a private welfare state for its paper pushers. All while the taxpayer is picking up a good portion of the tab.

The crux of my argument isn't that it's ideal or even acceptable, but these staff provide services for the university and in the majority of cases, directly to the students - the university would struggle to fulfil the demands placed on it without 1) radical transformation of hundreds of services (and being a part of wider community, ensuring that community is still sustainable), 2) employing more people. Which cohor…

It has nothing to do with automation. You could just eliminate half of the administrative workforce at these universities overnight and the important parts would keep running just fine.

For example, my university had a very extensive dining system, all within a block of town, which was full of restaurants. The dining halls were more expensive than the restaurants. But everyone had to buy a super-expensive meal plan, to prop up this ridiculous side-business of the university.

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#333

Post by anotheramala »

wastedhours wrote: post #66
stirlo wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was like WTF at this and had to google it. From Wikipedia... "Academic staff: 2,219 Administrative staff: 12,508 excluding SHC Students: 16,430" Oh how far western civilisation as fallen to end up with the statistics above. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_University

How far western civilisation has fallen to end up with employing people in middle level, secure (if inefficient) jobs! Excuse my flippancy, I've worked in universities before and they are horrendously inefficient - however , quite often in the cities where a big university is there's very few other large employers (where I was the joke at house parties was asking whether someone you'd never met worked for the univers…

It's more a wealth transfer mechanism from younger people to take out loans to fund these inefficiences. And those loans are gauranteed against a person's lifetime earnings since they cannot be removed via bankruptcy.

Remove the financial incentives for inefficient work and you will get 10,000 ways to make universities more efficient.

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#334

Post by pc86 »

wastedhours wrote: post #66
stirlo wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was like WTF at this and had to google it. From Wikipedia... "Academic staff: 2,219 Administrative staff: 12,508 excluding SHC Students: 16,430" Oh how far western civilisation as fallen to end up with the statistics above. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_University

How far western civilisation has fallen to end up with employing people in middle level, secure (if inefficient) jobs! Excuse my flippancy, I've worked in universities before and they are horrendously inefficient - however , quite often in the cities where a big university is there's very few other large employers (where I was the joke at house parties was asking whether someone you'd never met worked for the univers…

> where should these employees go?

Who cares?

Nobody is owed employment. Nobody is owed financial stability. If they have real, useful skills, get a job somewhere else, if not, they can go back to school. It will have just gotten a little bit cheaper.

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#335

Post by wu-ikkyu »

ekianjo wrote: post #186
mumin-abu-jamal wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"we have never had as much free time as now where we dont need to worry about food" We actually have less free time compared to hunter-gatherers. http://rewild.info/in-depth/leisure.html

Thats pre civilization. Does it count?

Yes, it's human history

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#336

Post by throwaway713824 »

tyleo wrote: post #287
jakidud wrote: post #279

Okay, I wasn't going to comment, but I thought this would be extremely relevant : I've been getting paid for free for the past four months. I've been turning up to work, reading novels all fucking day, eating at the company cafeteria, and leaving. I generally spend 4-6 hours at the office. For 4 months now. Let that sink in. What happened is that I transferred from a 'public' team to a 'private' team, which means tha…

Have you considered staying at the current job, not showing up, AND getting another job? I realize this is unethical but is it actually illegal? One of my friend’s coworkers did this but I didn’t know the coworker well enough to see how it turned out. I have always been curious.

I've advocated this for a long time, not something people are receptive to though. I've been in GPs position, I've done little or nothing for YEARS at various development jobs, I do some high visiblity things, but otherwise coast. It's bizarre, but i always get glowing reviews. I've spent years averaging 5 hours of work a week. It's easy in software if you're good at it.

The logical conclusion is maximize your earning moonlighting an additional job. It's hard though; to land one, and work two jobs concurrently. IF they're both remote helps a lot.

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#337

Post by khafra »

xivzgrev wrote: post #324

I don't think requiring a doctor's note is necessarily bullshit. Special chairs are more expensive so it's a shallow cut to prevent everyone wanting one just because it's available. If they are more comfortable and the two people sitting next to you have one, wouldn't you want one too? Now obviously there is potential for fraud and so there is some bs as the author notes. But let's not throw the baby out with the bat…

> Special chairs are more expensive

The patient wanted to bring in his own special chair, not get one purchased by the company.

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#338

Post by ry4nolson »

xivzgrev wrote: post #324

I don't think requiring a doctor's note is necessarily bullshit. Special chairs are more expensive so it's a shallow cut to prevent everyone wanting one just because it's available. If they are more comfortable and the two people sitting next to you have one, wouldn't you want one too? Now obviously there is potential for fraud and so there is some bs as the author notes. But let's not throw the baby out with the bat…

The note is to allow the employee to bring their own chair to work. How does this cost the company anything extra?

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#339

Post by lostapathy »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #140
Jaruzel wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that these jobs are bullshit jobs, it's that commonly they are wrapped up in bullshit procedures . These procedures typically appear when there's an initiative to reduce costs. The easiest and cheapest way to employ an unskilled person to do a skilled job is to hand them a book of 'procedures' on their first day and say "Everything you need to do and know is in this Book". No time consuming cross-training re…

This is what frustrated me after reading the "E-myth" book. Apparently, the recipe for successful business is to enshrine everything in superdetailed Book of Procedures, and have employees follow its content like they were programmable automatons. Now maybe this works , but eliminating human agency like this doesn't sit well with me for some reason.

I'm not sure the E-myth is really targeted at the kinds of tech businesses HN readers are after.

If you view it in the context of small-scale food/retail/manufacturing it fits really well. It doesn't fit well for creative efforts, but I'm not sure that invalidates the book either.

Re: Bullshit Jobs

#340

Post by emptyfile »

kathe-rine wrote: post #173
emptyfile wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How in the hell??? Is this considered extreme even in america?

My university is comparable to Stanford (Princeton) but has a roughly 1:1 faculty: administrator ratio (1200: to 1100).

That seems reasonable for an expensive US university, especially when compared to the post above.

I live in eastern europe and I was trying to remember what kind of administrative staff I encountered in my 6 years of university.

Apart from the people who handle the paperwork for admissions and cleaning ladies I honestly can't think any.

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