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Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

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Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#321

Post by wutwutwat »

dataflow wrote: post #283
Denzel wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a strange statement because I definitely canceled my subscription as a result of the happenings. This very public battle confirmed for me how misaligned OpenAI is with the originating charter and mission of its nonprofit. And I didn’t want to financially contribute towards that future anymore. I guess my subscription didn’t count as a customer.

Is there some technicality here that we're missing (e.g., is there a difference between you and other customers?) or is he just lying?

It's called "spin" in a press release/marketing, but we on the outside call it a lie, yes.

It wouldn't shock me to learn all of the events that took place were to get worldwide attention, and strengthen their financial footprint. I'd imagine not being able to be fired, and having the entire company ready to quit to follow you, sends a pretty clear signal to all VC that hitching your cart to any other AI wagon is suicide, because the bulletproof ceo has literally the people at the cutting edge of the entire market ready to go wherever he does. How could anyone give funding to a company besides his at this point? Might as well catch it on fire if you're going to give it to someone else's company.

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#322

Post by jacquesm »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #287
jacquesm wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, their statements are overflowing from bits and pieces of how they are doing this 'for all of humanity' so I'm not so sure about that. Think about it this way: if in the 1940's nuclear weapons were being developed in private hands don't you think the entity behind that would owe the public - or the government - some insight into what is going on?

Think about it this way: if in the 1940's nuclear weapons were being developed in private hands don't you think the entity behind that would owe the public - or the government - some insight into what is going on? I'd read the hell out of that alt-history novel, I can tell you that much. Not so much the "Manhattan Project" as the "Tuxedo Park Project."

If that time line had materialized you might not have been around to read it :)

But it's an interesting thought. Howard Hughes came close to having that kind of power and Musk has more or less eclipsed him now. Sam Altman could easily eclipse both, he seems to be better at power games (unfortunately, but that's what it is). Personally I think people that are that power hungry should be kept away from the levers of real power as much as possible because they will use it if the opportunity presents itself.

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#323

Post by causalmodels »

bogomipz wrote: post #306
telotortium wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a tweet that from an engineer at OpenAI that they're working on the problem that ChatGPT has become too "lazy" - generating text that contains a lot of placeholders and expecting people to fill in much more themselves. As for the general brain damage from RLHF and the political bias, no word still.

What is "RLHF" here?

Reinforcement learning from human feedback [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reinforcement_learning_from_hu...

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#324

Post by sanderjd »

firebirdn99 wrote: post #190
marcus0x62 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The board was a non profit board serving the mission. Mission was foremost. Employees are not. They need employees to advance their stated mission. > One of the comments a member made was, if the company was destroyed, it would still be consistent with serving the mission. Which is right. I mean, that's a nice sound bite and everything, but the only scenario where blowing up the company seems to be consistent with…

> Otherwise, to be relevant in guiding research towards AGI, they need to stay a going concern, and that means not running off 90% of the employee base. That's why they presumably agreed to find a solution. But at the same time shows that in essence, entities with for-profit incentives find a way to get what they want. There certainly needs to be more thought and discussion about governance, and how we collectively a…

I don't really think we need more thought and discussion on creative structures for "governance" of this technology. We already have governance; we call them governments, and we elect a bunch of representatives to run them, we don't rely on a few people on a self-appointed non profit board.

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#325

Post by davrosthedalek »

dataflow wrote: post #283
Denzel wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a strange statement because I definitely canceled my subscription as a result of the happenings. This very public battle confirmed for me how misaligned OpenAI is with the originating charter and mission of its nonprofit. And I didn’t want to financially contribute towards that future anymore. I guess my subscription didn’t count as a customer.

Is there some technicality here that we're missing (e.g., is there a difference between you and other customers?) or is he just lying?

It might be that there was no net outflow of customers. I am sure customers quit all the time, and others sign up. It probably means that they either didn't see a statistical relevant increase in churn, or that the amount of excess quits was compensated by excess new customers.

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#327

Post by ahahahahah »

civilized wrote: post #155
Berniek wrote: post #142

Who is driving the company (companies)? Certainly not the board, when it can be ousted on the whim of one person. Might as well just get rid of the board (all boards in this organization) as any decision made can be overthrown by a bit of publicity and ego. Perhaps it about getting rich at the expense of any ethics? Those who work for this company should bear this in mind, they are all expendable!

Hacker News represents hackers, not Boards of Directors. The hackers of OpenAI overwhelmingly demanded Sam back. Everyone here should be happy.

[flagged]

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#328

Post by starttoaster »

ribosometronome wrote: post #242
Terretta wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> staff threaten to quit overnight They didn't, though. They threatened to continue tomorrow! It's called "walking across the street" and there's an expression for it because it's a thing that happens if governance fails but Makers gonna Make. Microsoft was already running the environment, with rights to deliver it to customers, and added a paycheck for the people pouring themselves into it. The staff "threatened" to…

>They didn't, though. They threatened to continue tomorrow! Are you saying ~80% of OpenAI employees did not threaten to stop being employees of OpenAI during this kerfuffle?

They're saying that ~80% of OpenAI employees were determined to follow Sam to Microsoft and continue their work on GPT at Microsoft. They're saying this actually signals stability, as the majority of makers were determined to follow a leader to continue making the thing they were making, just in a different house. They're saying that while OpenAI had some internal tussling, the actual technology will see progress under whatever regime and whatever name they can continue creating the technology with/as.

At the end of the day, when you're using a good or service, are you getting into bed with the good/service? Or the company who makes it? If you've been buying pies from Anne's Bakery down the street, and you really like those pies, and find out that the person who made the pies started baking them at Joe's Diner instead, and Joe's Diner is just as far from your house and the pies cost about the same, you're probably going to go to Joe's Diner to get yourself some apple pie. You're probably not going to just start eating inferior pies, you picked these ones for a reason.

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#329

Post by sanderjd »

drooby wrote: post #138
sanderjd wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, their big mistake was being unwilling to be clear and explicit about this, but as I read it, the board's problem with him was that he wasn't actually acting as the executive of the non-profit that he was meant to be the executive of, but rather was acting entirely in the interests of a for-profit subsidiary of it (and in his own interests), which were in conflict with the non-profit's charter. I think where the…

It's just so strange. This is such a clearly justifiable reason that the fact that they didn't argue it... or argue.. anything, makes me very suspicious that it is correct.

Yeah, I totally agree! Like, this is such an obviously true and valid reason to fire him, but they never came out and said it! So ... is this not what it actually was? Or ... what? It truly is mystifying.

Re: Sam Altman returns as CEO, OpenAI has a new initial board

#330

Post by 0xDEAFBEAD »

zer0c00ler wrote: post #231
kaycebasques wrote: post #121

> The fact that we did not lose a single customer will drive us to work even harder for you, and we are all excited to get back to work. I'm not a big customer, but I am starting the process of moving away from OpenAI in response to these events

Yeah, OpenAI lost a bit of its magic. It's sad because it was really fun so far to see all the great progress. But there are so many unanswered questions still and the lack of transparency is an issue, as is the cult like behavior that can be observed recently.

For those who are curious here's some background on the "cult like behavior" rumors

https://nitter.net/JacquesThibs/status/1727134087176204410#m

"The early employees have the most $$$$ to lose and snort the company koolaid [...] They were calling people in the middle of the night"

"The before ChatGPT [employees] are cultists and Sam Altman bootlickers"

From anonymous posts on Blind, current/former OpenAI employee

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