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How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

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Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#321

Post by Xavdidtheshadow »

samcat116 wrote: post #279
jedberg wrote: post #129

I’ve only looked at the docs and not implemented it, but my impression was that if they leave the Apple ecosystem they lose access to your app. I suppose this is similar to any other “Sign in with” option, but it just seems more likely people will ditch Apple before they ditch gmail or Facebook, since they can keep those around pretty easily without using them or paying for them. For Apple you need to pay money and a…

I mean if you sign into something with Google and then delete your google account you end up with the same result no?

Yes, but deletion of a Google account (for a lot of people, the core of their whole internet experience) has way different probability than getting a new, non-apple phone.

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#322

Post by MagnumOpus »

coldtea wrote: post #317
StavrosK wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My music is in Spotify and Apple Music, my video is Netflix and Amazon Prime and Apple+ Does Spotify somehow integrate with Apple Music and Netflix with Apple+? Because, if not, your counterargument is just "there's no walled garden because I'm outside it". Spotify, Netflix, Google, Kindle, etc work on both platforms. Apple stuff doesn't. That's the definition of "walled garden", that you can't use Android and stil…

> Does Spotify somehow integrate with Apple Music and Netflix with Apple+? Because, if not, your counterargument is just "there's no walled garden because I'm outside it". No, my argument is "there's no walled garden because with subscriptions there are no walls to close you in". Apple Music is a subscription, you move to Spotify or Pandora or Youtube Music or whatever and that's that. You don't have the loss of your…

> You don't have the loss of your music or whatever

You just lose playlist and ratings

> you can trivially just use Kindle app on macOS/iOS

Except Apple cripples features of the Kindle app (you cannot buy books through the app because if you did, Apple would demand a 30% cut that represents all of the Amazon profits) that are not crippled in Apple's own offering.

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#323

Post by noelsusman »

rootusrootus wrote: post #243
noelsusman wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iMessage has done more to hold back messaging in the US than anything else. Even if Google was competent at messaging it wouldn't matter because iOS users wouldn't switch and Apple refuses to open up iMessage to non-Apple devices. I'm still using SMS for most of my messaging, and I primarily blame Apple for that.

Are you asking for Apple to pay for infrastructure for non-customers to use? Or even further, that Apple design and support an Android iMessage app?

Yes, and I am a customer. I own a Macbook, and I would love to use iMessage on it, but doing so would mean losing all of my messages as soon as I pick up a different device. That makes iMessage (and most Apple services) completely useless to me, a paying customer.

Their decision to wall off iMessage actively hurts their own customers by preventing them from seamlessly communicating with the most popular mobile OS using modern technology. They get away with it because they're Apple and they make good products, but that doesn't mean I have to think it's good.

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#324

Post by simple-login »

Disclaimer: I'm the founder of this service.

I wouldn't trust a closed-source solution to be the privacy-focused identity provider. And with "Apple Search Ads", Apple could also be considered as an advertising company.

I have actually started out to create a privacy-focused SSO solution named "Sign In with SimpleLogin" [1] before "Sign in with Apple" was announced. The solution is from the beginning meant to be open source and even self-hostable. It's superior than "Sign in with Apple" in several ways:

- The dev experiences is far better

- The random email part is customized

- Name, avatar could also be customized

If you visit the home page, you would notice that it's talking mainly about the email alias part as the SimpleLogin button is not implemented on popular websites yet, which hopefully will come soon.

[1]: https://simplelogin.io/developer

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#325

Post by coldtea »

MagnumOpus wrote: post #322
coldtea wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does Spotify somehow integrate with Apple Music and Netflix with Apple+? Because, if not, your counterargument is just "there's no walled garden because I'm outside it". No, my argument is "there's no walled garden because with subscriptions there are no walls to close you in". Apple Music is a subscription, you move to Spotify or Pandora or Youtube Music or whatever and that's that. You don't have the loss of your…

> You don't have the loss of your music or whatever You just lose playlist and ratings > you can trivially just use Kindle app on macOS/iOS Except Apple cripples features of the Kindle app (you cannot buy books through the app because if you did, Apple would demand a 30% cut that represents all of the Amazon profits) that are not crippled in Apple's own offering.

>You just lose playlist and ratings

Yes, so peanuts (most people don't even use ratings according to some article I've read - it's for the OCD music nerds, not the millions who just listen to hits and might or might not add some playlists - of which they don't really obsess over).

>Except Apple cripples features of the Kindle app (you cannot buy books through the app because if you did, Apple would demand a 30% cut that represents all of the Amazon profits) that are not crippled in Apple's own offering.

That would be Amazon's crippling it, as it's their choice. They could pay that 30% cut. They themselves demand a 65% cut from authors and publishers at worst case, and 30% (same as Apple) at best.

And again, both very ho-hum example of barriers to move platform.

If stuff like "I'll lose my playlists" is what prevents someone from leaving Apple, then that's the most open walled garden ever...

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#326

Post by tekknik »

anoncake wrote: post #311
tekknik wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ok? and googles messaging app only runs on android. the app doesn’t require the recipient to have imessage, however if they do you get benefits (like increased message size) over sms due to limitations in sms.

Which one? Hangouts runs on iOS. The one for SMS and MMS does not but does Apple even allow that?

hangouts is dead, so again can i run googles sms app on an iphone? further google killed xmpp support which would’ve allowed 3rd party clients to use their message services

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#327

Post by tekknik »

coldtea wrote: post #318
tekknik wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how about the $5k or so in media i have in googles ecosystem? their apps are literally garbage on ios and i had to resort to using youtube to watch content i paid for. even this didn’t work after some time as i have so much media even the youtube app started timing out when loading my purchases. there is no compatible format for ios, so you gotta use their garbage apps. it became such a huge problem that i bought eve…

> how about the $5k or so in media i have in googles ecosystem? their apps are literally garbage on ios I've never seen any Google app being a problem on iOS, much less garbage. It just doesn't have the native look due to Material theming.

read my post again, you clearly don’t have enough media to be a problem. on all devices both the google play app and youtube timeout or lock the device up due to the amount of media i have. garbage is an understatement considering how much i spent with them and that I can’t even view any of it anymore without watching on a full desktop / laptop

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#328

Post by jedberg »

samcat116 wrote: post #279
jedberg wrote: post #129

I’ve only looked at the docs and not implemented it, but my impression was that if they leave the Apple ecosystem they lose access to your app. I suppose this is similar to any other “Sign in with” option, but it just seems more likely people will ditch Apple before they ditch gmail or Facebook, since they can keep those around pretty easily without using them or paying for them. For Apple you need to pay money and a…

I mean if you sign into something with Google and then delete your google account you end up with the same result no?

Yeah, but like I said, it doesn't cost much to keep a Google account around that you aren't using.

It costs a lot to maintain yourself in the Apple ecosystem.

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#329

Post by benhurmarcel »

Marsymars wrote: post #290
benhurmarcel wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About 6 months ago I was unable to use my email on a personal domain to create an Apple ID. I had to create an @icloud.com address. And I don't think it's an issue with my domain, it's been fine for the last 9 years.

FYI you can normally change the email on an Apple ID after creation, without the domain restrictions that are present for initial creation.

Great to know, thank you

Re: How Popular Is “Sign in with Apple”?

#330

Post by pwinnski »

gamblor956 wrote: post #204
pwinnski wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By default, supporting one means supporting the other, but in practice, several large chain stores deliberately disabled ApplePay specifically at first, hoping to choke it off. That seems to have failed, and I can't remember the last time I saw a place that took contactless payment but not ApplePay, but it was a thing for a while.

in practice, several large chain stores deliberately disabled ApplePay specifically at first, hoping to choke it off. This is FUD spread by Apple after poor uptake of Apple Pay. The reality is that many retail chains and restaurants either hadn't enabled the NFC chips in their payment terminals, or were using old terminals that didn't even have NFC functionality, and thus did not work with Apple Pay. Retailers that s…

Best Buy supported NFC payments generally until Apple Pay launched in 2014. After that I saw the NFC logo on their terminals still, but every time I tried to use Apple Pay, it would report an error. Cashiers told me each time that "Google Pay" would work, but not Apple Pay.

Perhaps they were lying, or mistaken.

But you were specifically calling out my claim of chain stores deliberately eschewing Apple Pay as FUD, which is weird, because they were quite open about it at the time. Walmart has kept up their QR-code-only approach, while the others gave up on CurrenC eventually.

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