Earlier quoted context omitted.
No we don't. We're accepting it as if it's our only option.
What’s the other option?
Consumers can pay for Ladybird themselves.
A culture that encourages rewarding creators for their work.
Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
311–320 of 510 posts
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#312Earlier quoted context omitted.
LuaJIT was developed by one person. Ladybird doesn't need hundreds of millions of dollars, it needs interpreter specialists who are willing to lend their time to the project, and an army of volunteers to work on the rest of the rendering engine.
LuaJIT has ~85k lines of code. Chromium and Firefox have somewhere in the neighborhood of ~30 million. If you need ~1 developer for "a LuaJIT" then you need ~350 developers for a browser.
The assumption that a browser needs ~30 million lines of code may be false.
It may be possible for a scripting language with at least the same features as LuaJIT to be as fast as LuaJIT in less than 85K lines of code.
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#313Earlier quoted context omitted.
Responding to a dead comment from a banned account: > The big new game for them is AI crawler metering. Don’t think browser matters much anymore from their perspective. Truly open browsers are easy to spoof. Approved browsers with whatever attestation features they champion builtin are hard to spoof. So browsers do matter. Edit: authentication => attestation for accuracy.
Browser attestation doesn't really matter, its device attestation. Browser attestation is downstream from that. Google with SafetyNet attestation (whatever the hell its called these days) has pretty much locked down Android as tightly as iOS at this point. Hell, Apple device users already get to go in the internet "approved" fast lane because of attestation. iDevices and M-series Macbooks can send out a special respo…
I think this is why things like the mdl ID standard are important. It allows for a privacy preserving and open approach not controlled by big companies. It's not perfect, it's controlled by government. But I'd like government to at least challenge the power of Google and Apple.
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#314Earlier quoted context omitted.
Cloudflare supporting Ladybird makes sense for the same reasons that Valve invests in Proton. Cloudflare's job is easier if everyone standardizes on a few approved browsers, but right now the three major browser engines are controlled by Google (IIRC most of Mozilla's funding comes from Google) and Apple, just as Valve's Steam is heavily dependent on Microsoft's Windows. Both companies are basically hedging against f…
That response ignores the fact that Valve isn't in the business of preventing you from playing your games on niche operating systems but Cloudflare is in the business of blocking non-standard browsers. If Cloudflare truly wants to prevent a Google/Apple web duopoly the most effective thing they can do is to stop blocking alternatives or even just browser- configurations that are Google-hostile.
> Valve isn't in the business of preventing you from playing your games on niche operating systems
Getting your Steam library to work on Linux before it got Valve's blessing with Proton wasn't a great experience. If they wanted to, they could have easily decided to block games from running on Linux and gave some statement about preventing piracy and protecting users from malware.
I'm optimistic that this investment means we'll see more open standards and large browser makers being forced to collaborate and create simpler standards without compromising security.
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#315Earlier quoted context omitted.
Before they swapped Edge over to use Chromium they were capable of maintaining their own engine just fine. Probably not overnight, but in the past they have shown that they have the budget to support a browser engine if they want to.
Why do you think they moved to Chromium then? They switched because they could not support a competitive engine by themselves.
They are on the record about why they switched to a chromium based browser. It’s been a while, but if I’m remembering correctly, at the time Google was making changes to YouTube to make it actively slower, and use more power on IE. Microsoft realized that while they could compete as a browser, they couldn’t compete and fight google trying to do underhanded things to sabotage their browser.
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#316Earlier quoted context omitted.
I am pretty sure all the stuff is optional and the main point is having everything like drivers working right away instead of looking for solutions yourself
That's something most distros do already, or at least try to. Good default setup and working drivers Ubuntu aimed for a decade ago. So that would not be exciting. Maybe it's more about the willingness to include software other distros see critically and would not include by default, like docker.
> at least try to
this. they try to be un-opinionated.
The difference is of taste.
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#317Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is Ladybird a tech right thing?
Somewhat - Kling is explicitly 'apolitical' and this always attracts a certain ilk of people. --- And - maybe this is a stretch, but you also have to consider that the competing product (Servo) is written in Rust, while Ladybird is C++. From what you read on hn, I think Rusts community being very liberal sort of resulted in memory safety being perceived as a culture war thing by some; ("authoritarian big compiler is…
I'm not sure how true that is when half the Rust job postings are cryptocurrency related.
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#318[flagged]
Posted elsewhere in this thread, it appears that ladybird does not have a great record in this dept.
https://hyperborea.org/reviews/software/ladybird-inclusivity...
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#319Earlier quoted context omitted.
Managing servers that store terabytes of data for you isn't exactly the same as configuring and stitching Linux programs together.
My point is that it’s not about what work is done, but about what users get from that work. Everyone could, in theory, learn how to configure Arch and Hyprland, but most of us don’t have the time or interest to do it. So Omarchy is to Arch something similar of what Ubuntu was to Debian 15 years ago.
It's not, though, Ubuntu worked out a lot of UI/UX that is just not there in Debian.
Omarchy is mostly a custom configuration of the same OS, nothing more ...
I agree that they should have sponsored Arch directly instead but nepos gonna nepo.
Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy
#320I’m skeptical. Cloudflare clearly wants to move us to a future where only approved browsers are allowed to access the web. People have been fiercely debating whether that’s a terrible thing, or whether that’s the least bad practical solution on offer for website owners. I don’t want to make a judgement on that, but I don’t think the observation that CF is pushing us in that direction is very controversial. But an ind…
I don't understand why we always assume bad faith. I wish more companies were like Cloudflare actually - trying to balance the need of revenues while trying to do good for internet and open source as a whole. As a normal user with a few sites, I'm glad they provide what they provide to block bots, attacks and everything AI.
Cloudflare is 100% acting in bad faith.
They're a gatekeeper to a large chunk of Internet already. If they decide that your IP range stinks? Hope you enjoy your ration of 22 captcha pages a day!
Now, they're making some very transparent moves to leverage what they have to get even more control. And once they get even more control? It's not an "if" they start choking you with it to get more revenue. It's a "when".
People used to say "I wish more companies were like Google". They don't say that anymore.