I've been using vim for years, switched to neovim, and at this point I'm ready to throw in the towel and just use vscode for anything beyond simple text editing. The amount of work needed to get a basic IDE up and running for your languages of choice, even for commonly used languages such as Python or Javascript, is far too much for someone who wants to get on with their day job or hobby coding and doesn't want to sp…
LazyVim
311–320 of 537 posts
Re: LazyVim
#312Earlier quoted context omitted.
[flagged]
As if there are "studies" backing the claim that arrow keys are easier to use for navigation than the home row keys... Personally I don't want to move my hands from where I'm writing to the other side of they keyboard just to move the cursor.
In the end, use whatever your feel most comfortable. I hate the VSCode interface and all of those notifications/popups and general slow interface, but I can understand who doesn't care or think that even with those VSCode is still more efficient for them. I also can completely understand the issue that folks say when they lost a long time tuning their Neovim configuration to their preferences, considering that I just have done so. But I still prefer neovim to VSCode nowadays, and not everyone needs to think the same, and this is fine.
Re: LazyVim
#313Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you want IDE like features, then of course an IDE is a better choice. I've never understood why people and to extend vim to try to make it half of an IDE.
a colleague of mine answered the same question with: "jetbrains products reek of java" which i translated to "cluttered ui" and "not responsive".
Re: LazyVim
#314Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd recommend trying a neovim distro like lunarvim out. It has black and all other typical ide features configured out of the box and doesn't mess with your normal neovim config.
I tried out spacevim, but then some feature was getting in my way and I couldn't figure out how to turn it off (I've forgotten what now). I think thats a disadvantage to some of these heavily customized vim flavors. Plugins don't necessarily work out of the box, and when they do they promote their own way of interaction that sometimes needs to be learned.
Re: LazyVim
#315I've been using vim for years, switched to neovim, and at this point I'm ready to throw in the towel and just use vscode for anything beyond simple text editing. The amount of work needed to get a basic IDE up and running for your languages of choice, even for commonly used languages such as Python or Javascript, is far too much for someone who wants to get on with their day job or hobby coding and doesn't want to sp…
> I don't like being sucked back into the Microsoft ecosystem You’re not though, there’s no lock-in.
Re: LazyVim
#316Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The amount of work needed to get a basic IDE up and running for your languages of choice, even for commonly used languages such as Python or Javascript, is far too much for someone who wants to get on with their day job or hobby coding and doesn't want to spend precious hours fixing obscure issues in Lua. First off, editing Python (I am not familiar with Javascript enough to make any claims about it) doesn't requir…
> I agree that neovim is not for people who are not interested in learning their tools. That, right there, is one of the biggest turnoffs I have encountered from the community. The sheer disdain in that sentence alone. I learn many tools, and am deeply interested in learning them. That includes languages, frameworks, databases, infrastructure tools, operating systems, standards and protocols. I wouldn't be in this jo…
I'm sorry that you read it this way, I think I could have written it differently. That being said, I don't agree that any of the things you listed are tools.
Moreover, reading what you wrote in your original comment from a more negative stance, I also think it's easy to read it as disdainful but I chose not to read it that way. I would appreciate it if you were more positive in your reading of what I write.
Tools in my mind are things like: a keyboard, your IDE/editor, your build system, your VCS, your userspace utilities (sed, awk, cat, ls, grep, etc), code formatters, code linters. I guess "tool" is probably not the best name for these categories given that I can understand why you would also call a library a tool but to bring in an analogy from woodworking, tools are things you use to make things from the materials (what would be libraries, frameworks, programming languages, etc).
So having this distinction in mind, I don't think it's necessarily incorrect to state that you are of the opinion that what I would categorise as "tools" are not worth learning and (I should add) modifying.
Again, I would like to stress, I am not trying to make any objective claims as to how correct your approach is. I am simply observing that there seem to be broadly two categories of programmers. Those who feel like investing time in learning and writing/modifying "tooling" is worthwhile and those who do not. I feel like you fall into the latter category.
In this sense, I don't think vim, neovim, or emacs are really appropriate for people who don't feel like time spent learning and writing or modifying (let's call them) peripheral tools is worthwhile. Whereas you feel constrained by the need to understand what to you might feel are "irrelevant details" (the need to know the API) about neovim, I feel constrained by what you might feel are "irrelevant details" (the need to adjust to a specific workflow which I might not be used to, the need to constrain myself to a specific set of plugins) about VScode.
That being said, I will say again, to claim that vim takes a lot of time to use and configure is simply wrong. But if you feel like having to learn an API to use an editor is a waste of time then it would explain why your experience might be like this. It's not possible to use vim quickly without having learned the API. Likewise, I feel like having to adjust to a specific way of editing as envisioned by a specific company and a specific plugin writer is a waste of my time and it would explain why my experience of VScode is that it takes a lot of time to configure and use whereas your experience is different. This doesn't mean that VScode takes a lot of time to use and configure, just that it's fundamentally not for me.
I hope the above clarifies things. I would be happy to agree on a different term than "tool" or a clearer way to distinguish between e.g. an IDE and a library or framework.
Re: LazyVim
#317Am I the only one using vanilla vim with a minimal configuration file ( Very easy to setup. Moreover, when I'm on a different computer and open (vanilla) vim without any configurations. I know that everything is more or less the same as my default vim environment. I think it's not that hard to learn developing in the default vim environment, with some minor tweaks. Also related, How to Do 90% of What Plugins Do (With…
I was absolutely thrilled to find that VSCode’s vim emulation included vim-surround! I guess someone out there has the same problem I do.
So much programming is editing various text surrounds: parents, braces, brackets, quotes of various flavors.
I also really like having semantic completions. I get by with YouCompleteMe, but it’s a little jank in my build system.
Re: LazyVim
#318Best protip I heard about (n)vim customization: use git branches when you want to switch between different configurations. Eg something like: - vanilla/default - minimal - fancy depending on what you want to deal with. If I go months between using all these plugins I forget what they do and what changed and it’s just noisy distractions that invariably lead me to open my init.lua file rather than what I actually had i…
Re: LazyVim
#319Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is the problem though: if you come to Neovim, and ask "what is the best formatter/linter" someone will tell you "use null-ls". Then a dozen others will say "don't use null-ls, it's been deprecated, use efm-langserver". OK, how do I set up efm-langserver with Neovim? Good luck! You could probably use a plugin, or maybe not. You'll need a way to install LSP servers. nvm-lsp-installer? Nope,that's also deprecated,…
So basically your problem is feeling insecure because other people do different choices. I didn't care following all the trends, my setup use coc.nvim[1] and I don't have any problem with that. I don't care about black, I am fine writing python stuff without it. Your setup doesn't have to be complicated because others is. [1] which is still maintained by the way.
Re: LazyVim
#320Earlier quoted context omitted.
Spacemacs defaults to fd, I don't think I ever accidentally left insert mode with that. Happy vscode user these days. If I find myself fiddling with an editor it's a huge red flag to me that I hate what I'm working on.
fd sounds much worse as now you can't jump to d characters.