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Voat Is Shutting Down

voat.co

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Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#311

Post by janoc »

ignoranceprior wrote: post #4

Voat was founded as a neutral free-speech platform. After alt-right extremists were booted off reddit, they found a new home there. The site was bombarded by /pol/ chan culture, and after that nobody else of other political persuasions really wanted to join. Kind of like that "paradox of intolerance" meme. Free speech platforms usually end up becoming extremist platforms. I remember going on voat a couple years ago a…

Well, the front page has literally "Holocaust didn't happen" plastered on it right now (crime in many EU countries) ...

Not really going to miss this one. "Neutral" and "free-speech" have unfortunately become euphemisms for a license to spew hate that wouldn't be allowed elsewhere (i.e "censored").

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#312

Post by dmje »

cbozeman wrote: post #141
ignoranceprior wrote: post #4

Voat was founded as a neutral free-speech platform. After alt-right extremists were booted off reddit, they found a new home there. The site was bombarded by /pol/ chan culture, and after that nobody else of other political persuasions really wanted to join. Kind of like that "paradox of intolerance" meme. Free speech platforms usually end up becoming extremist platforms. I remember going on voat a couple years ago a…

Its not that free speech platforms are destined to fail, its anonymity. You're not responsible for your words. That's why these fail. Notice I use my real name here on this website. Not a pseudonym. Whatever I say here, I would say to you in front of your face. Same as I do on Facebook and Twitter and Reddit and the other areas I post. I've always used my real name. I'll always use my real name. We don't require anyo…

100% nodding

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#313

Post by Consultant32452 »

renewiltord wrote: post #279
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Free speech platforms usually end up being extremist platforms. ...when the popular platforms stop being free speech platforms. Reddit, in its earlier days, was never dominated by the Voat contingent. They were there, but they were far less extreme there than they were on Voat. And then whenever they would post rank inaccuracies, there were clearer-minded people to point out why they were wrong, in the same place w…

> So the answer has to be to stop the witch hunts in the places where everybody else already is. Got to be honest, bro, I don't really care to sacrifice for "the good of society" or whatever. If you make a website where some dude is going to post anti-Semitic shit everywhere and someone else is going to have to politely explain that Jewish lizard people are not conspiring to elect a Black woman as President then sure…

You pay for it one way or the other. People who don't feel heard radicalize and do things like commit street violence or mass killings.

>Like, I don't see you moving to the ghetto and putting your kids in shitty schools so that you can even things out.

I don't know about your schools, but around here the "magnet" schools with the high level law/math/science/etc programs are ALL in the bad schools. They do this to attract high performing students to poor performing schools. So if you want the benefit of the best public school education specifically geared towards your interest, you pay for it by going to a "bad" school.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#314

Post by verroq »

ashtonkem wrote: post #253
ninkendo wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly this. Folks can rant about free speech all they want, but no sane person would actually want to experience it. I support your right to speak, but doesn’t mean I want to listen to you. IMO the only parts of the internet that should be absolutely required to allow unfiltered (legal, protected) speech, should be ISP’s, and maybe datacenters that rent out physical rack space. Everyone else should absolutely consi…

> Folks can rant about free speech all they want, but no sane person would actually want to experience it. Always remember that "free speech" is 100% about the right to say what you want and not be prosecuted for it . It has never, ever been about the social consequences of any particular one person's speech. Insulting your boss and getting fired isn't an abridgement of free speech, neither is getting banned from the…

>Always remember that "free speech" is 100% about the right to say what you want and not be prosecuted for it

No I don’t remember. You can have “free speech” except the social consequences are that your neighbours lynch you in the streets. No I don’t recall it like that. Free speech has always been absolute because the majority opinion is immune from social consequences. It is the minority opinion that requires protection.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#315

Post by ngcazz »

piokoch wrote: post #309
renewiltord wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So the answer has to be to stop the witch hunts in the places where everybody else already is. Got to be honest, bro, I don't really care to sacrifice for "the good of society" or whatever. If you make a website where some dude is going to post anti-Semitic shit everywhere and someone else is going to have to politely explain that Jewish lizard people are not conspiring to elect a Black woman as President then sure…

Yes, but there is some middle ground between antisemitism and following what mainstream loves the a given point of time. And right now if someone dares to stick outside mainstream views this is considered hate speech, anti-XXX, etc. Can we discuss if overweight people should pay more for sits in a plane? Can we discuss if a trans male who identifies herself to be a woman should be allowed to take part in female sport…

It’s tiring to have to repeat that you’re proposing debating the legitimacy of the humanity of certain people as though it merited debate.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#316

Post by QuesnayJr »

jcims wrote: post #222
duskwuff wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of it probably started out as performative, but later became sincere -- either as users on the site became further radicalized, or as the site became a magnet for users who actually believed the awful things they were saying.

When I first moved to my current home I installed a big wood stove in the basement to help keep the home warm. Over the next few years I learned a lot empirically about how fire works. One of the more interesting lessons was how important it is to use the radiant heat from a burning piece of wood to build and sustain heat in other pieces of wood. It works a bit like fuel rods in a fission reaction. When you keep the…

That's a really striking analogy.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#317

Post by croon »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #50
ignoranceprior wrote: post #4

Voat was founded as a neutral free-speech platform. After alt-right extremists were booted off reddit, they found a new home there. The site was bombarded by /pol/ chan culture, and after that nobody else of other political persuasions really wanted to join. Kind of like that "paradox of intolerance" meme. Free speech platforms usually end up becoming extremist platforms. I remember going on voat a couple years ago a…

> Free speech platforms usually end up being extremist platforms. ...when the popular platforms stop being free speech platforms. Reddit, in its earlier days, was never dominated by the Voat contingent. They were there, but they were far less extreme there than they were on Voat. And then whenever they would post rank inaccuracies, there were clearer-minded people to point out why they were wrong, in the same place w…

I just have to say I strongly disagree, and I've been on the internet for a while (multiple decades).

The only reason reddit wasn't overrun by asshats even before more subreddits were banned were due to moderation. The same has been true for all forums and BBS:es since the beginning of time.

Truth and sensibility doesn't win out. The loudest voices with the least filtered speech does, because the least amount of filter produces the most amount of output.

With risk of making too broad of a generalization, everything dies without moderation.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#319

Post by krapp »

specialist wrote: post #135
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Free speech platforms usually end up being extremist platforms. ...when the popular platforms stop being free speech platforms. Reddit, in its earlier days, was never dominated by the Voat contingent. They were there, but they were far less extreme there than they were on Voat. And then whenever they would post rank inaccuracies, there were clearer-minded people to point out why they were wrong, in the same place w…

What would a witch hunt free reddit look like?

Voat.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#320

Post by phoe-krk »

berryjerry wrote: post #266
raldi wrote: post #84

Moderated communities beat unmoderated ones on any metric you can name. Always have, always will. Nobody wants to drink at a pub that won't throw out rude patrons.

This is dead on correct. The problem is online most people don't have to hear what you say, they can just not subscribe or not follow you and never hear a word of what you said. This is why over-moderation on the big tech sites like Reddit, Youtube, Twitter, and Facebook is so frustrating. It goes beyond kicking someone out of the bar to not allowing someone to open a bar. And they get their moderation wrong, and I m…

> It goes beyond kicking someone out of the bar to not allowing someone to open a bar.

You can open your bar just fine. Just don't expect someone else to invite people in there for you.

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