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Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

thetimes.co.uk

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Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#311

Post by neverartful »

motohagiography wrote: post #90

These trends are set in contrast to times when fraternal organizations provided a kind of social fabric that isn't the norm now. For men who are recognizing that social isolation is a long term risk in their lives and want to do something about it, I heartily recommend looking into these organizations. They're a mixed bag, like anything, but a bunch of guys who can hold anything together for decades should make anyon…

Good points. It seems like Knights of Columbus is one of the strongest today. Their membership is predicated on being Catholic and probably having some level of involvement with the associated church parish.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#312

Post by roel_v »

Yoric wrote: post #40
chrisseaton wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you have any hobbies that give you a social life outside your work or family?

Hobbies might not be sufficient for a social life. I used to train seriously in mixed-martial arts. While I had no issue with any of my training mates, I also had zero interest in hanging out with them. Likewise for other, strictly cerebral, activities.

Maybe not as in 'having a beer at each others houses', but when you go to each others fights as a team, go to seminars/camps together, or just work through your fight prep together at 4 or 6 week periods at a time, you develop bonds that cannot be described any other way than 'friendships', wouldn't you say? I mean sure, training 2 to 5 times a week in the gym, saying hi when you come in and see you when you leave doesn't give you that, but you can't be a complete fighter without friendships. I mean if dripping sweat into another guys mouth and rubbing all over each other wearing tights doesn't build friendships, what does?

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#313

Post by humanrebar »

scarface74 wrote: post #296
humanrebar wrote: post #159

I only see a couple mentions of religious organizations, but it's worth pointing out that churches and other religious organizations put an enormous amount of effort into making meaningful friendships convenient and healthy, including casual events, lectures, classes, study groups, and group volunteer activities. I'm not positive that the amount of attention given men in particular is comparable to children, women, c…

Church is so judgmental and limiting of the types of activities you can enjoy and you have to be so careful you follow the church norms. I’ll call up one of my friends and say - “hey. Let’s go out and drink, cuss, and tell lies”. I can’t very well do that with church folks. Let alone argue against church doctrine when it comes to drinking, premarital sex (I am married now), homosexuality, etc. I grew up going to what…

> Church is so judgmental...

I think you are conflating judgemental attitudes and having standards at all. You don't have to be a deist to think getting sloppy drunk and lying is lame.

And my experience is that actual church folks, not the "church is my country club" types are actually pretty welcoming. But, yeah, if you show up to service high, someone might ask you to leave. I don't consider that a moral or humanitarian failing. On the contrary, it's usually about protecting people more than self righteousness.

But mileage varies in all of this, of course.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#314

Post by nmstoker »

Maybe this isn't a universal viewpoint, but to me if the concern is to increase social connections amongst men, it seems odd to lump that in with hobbies like it's some bonus goal.

I know there are some hobbies that force you into a social situation but most hobbies seem a consumer of time in a reasonably solitary way and thus would further reduce any opportunity to socialise in the scarce hours when one is not working, asleep or traveling to work.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#315

Post by bloody-crow »

sneak wrote: post #306
bloody-crow wrote: post #297

This is the post I've finally decided to start an alt HN account for. I'm one of those men with no close friends. Or any friends, for what it's worth. I've had a few people in my life that I had very good friendships at a time, but all of them now live very far and we don't maintain any contact. I'm married and my wife covers all my emotional needs. While I realize how dysfunctional such state of affairs is, I just c…

Where do you live? What are your hobbies and interests?

Seattle suburbs. Coding, videogames, cars.

I've recently fell out of all of my hobbies and even stopped playing online games where I had some community going on.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#316

Post by motohagiography »

Aloha wrote: post #127
motohagiography wrote: post #90

These trends are set in contrast to times when fraternal organizations provided a kind of social fabric that isn't the norm now. For men who are recognizing that social isolation is a long term risk in their lives and want to do something about it, I heartily recommend looking into these organizations. They're a mixed bag, like anything, but a bunch of guys who can hold anything together for decades should make anyon…

As a gay male, I often have an additional wrinkle - in the Masonic orders, Eagles, Elks, or Moose Lodge, I feel I would be the odd man out in these situation.

To clarify, I also know a few gay men in lodges, sexuality isn't an issue there.

Being recognized as a good guy by a bunch of other guys is no small feat. Someone who is trustworthy, kind, fair minded, honest, with only moderate conceits, good natured, charitable, and magnanimous is rare to begin with. I think if someone has these qualities, there is very, very little that will stand in their way.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#317

Post by intrasight »

scarface74 wrote: post #304
intrasight wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think there is a social taboo - I think it's more of a self-imposed taboo because we've been told forever that men and woman can't just be friends. I've found that if you are clear that you just want to be friends then there is no discomfort, and they will treat you nearly exactly the same as they treat there female friends. They will share their feelings, their concerns, their aspirations. That what needs to…

The issue with having “platonic” female friends is that it can easily lead to emotionally infidelity and trust issues anytime there is a hint of any issues with your marriage. Maintaining a healthy marriage is hard enough without bringing in that complication. My only female friends these days are married and we are “couple friends”.

You reach an age (I have) where that's just no longer an issue.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#318

Post by humanrebar »

nitrogen wrote: post #275
humanrebar wrote: post #159

I only see a couple mentions of religious organizations, but it's worth pointing out that churches and other religious organizations put an enormous amount of effort into making meaningful friendships convenient and healthy, including casual events, lectures, classes, study groups, and group volunteer activities. I'm not positive that the amount of attention given men in particular is comparable to children, women, c…

It's a bit disappointing that community and belief system have to be intertwined. If one changes (you change beliefs, or your local community doesn't suit you), the other suffers (you lose your friends, or you have to pretend to believe something you don't). I used to be devoutly religious through my mid twenties. In hindsight that was a mistake for me personally because the community surrounding that religion didn't…

Good community takes work and consistency among other things. Often you put in hard work, end up personally worse off, but everyone else benefits. Often, the connection between action and benefit are very disconnected.

Point being, at least in my experience, it's not possible to separate belief from community. Things like prioritizing forgiveness do not make both intellectual and emotional sense. At least not enough to keep families together, let alone groups less officially affiliated.

Re: Almost one in five men admits to having no close friends, a survey has found

#319

Post by scarface74 »

humanrebar wrote: post #313
scarface74 wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Church is so judgmental and limiting of the types of activities you can enjoy and you have to be so careful you follow the church norms. I’ll call up one of my friends and say - “hey. Let’s go out and drink, cuss, and tell lies”. I can’t very well do that with church folks. Let alone argue against church doctrine when it comes to drinking, premarital sex (I am married now), homosexuality, etc. I grew up going to what…

> Church is so judgmental... I think you are conflating judgemental attitudes and having standards at all. You don't have to be a deist to think getting sloppy drunk and lying is lame. And my experience is that actual church folks, not the "church is my country club" types are actually pretty welcoming. But, yeah, if you show up to service high, someone might ask you to leave. I don't consider that a moral or humanit…

It’s not getting sloppy drunk, it’s even having a few drinks. “Telling lies” is also short hand for “talking shit” and you taking things to the extreme (drinking == “getting sloppy drunk”) and taking “telling lies” literally, kind of proves my point.

When I’m out with my friends or we are playing cards and we are talking trash to each other, I’m not concerned with “having standards”, we are going to cuss, drop some f-bombs, make off color jokes about ourselves, etc and not have to worry about offending someone’s sensibilities.

It’s like going to an all you can eat Brazilian Steakhouse with a holier than thou vegan who I know from past experience is card carrying member of PETA. Why would I put myself around that when I am trying to enjoy myself? I have to put on enough of a false face at work and cater to corporate norms.

As far as being “welcoming” not only would too many churches not be welcoming of a non straight couple (I am straight), according to surveys, 20% of evangelical churches still think interracial marriage is a sin.

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