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Pardon Snowden

pardonsnowden.org

311–320 of 814 posts

Re: Pardon Snowden

#311
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The assumption is that he has been convicted by a secret court (FISA).

I think you need to adjust your tinfoil hat. FISA does not have jurisdiction to hear any criminal complaints.

It's pretty shitty to throw the term "tinfoil hat" in an argument, especially so when discussing Snowden. It's also pretty silly to make the assumption that there hasn't been some sort of secret equivalent of conviction given everything we've learned about how opaque our government is.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#312
How do you know this guy (and the whole set of characters and institutions that he legitimizes -- Greenwald, Omidyar & co, Washington Post, Guardian, the Intercept, the 'blessed' crypto, etc.) -- are on the up and up?

Everything about this story, its central "hero", and the cast of characters of the show, smells imo.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#313
post #294

Snowden is a traitor. He gave up diplomatic cables that hurt our alliances all over the world and most of what he released ended up in Osama Bin Ladens hands. I can't name one good thing that has come from his whistleblowing. Perhaps, you didn't read the Patriot Act? It's pretty easy to see this guy basically said hey they are using the Patriot Act... Silly.

Snowden didn't directly release anything; he relied upon the Media to apply filters to what should and shouldn't be public. And they've done a reasonable job at that.

> I can't name one good thing that has come from his whistleblowing.

You think there is absolutely no value whatsoever in awareness that particular mechanisms were going against your rights to privacy?

Re: Pardon Snowden

#314

Everyone seems to forget that Snowden didn't just leak information about domestic spying, but also about unquestionably legitimate spying on foreign countries. There's no way he gets a pardon for that.

> unquestionably legitimate

Absolutely questionable. There's a concept called "human rights" and just because the US has failed to force unaccountable government agencies into acting in a humane and moral manner doesn't mean that what they're doing is justified. Invasions of privacy on foreign people on such a granular level is abhorrent and that fact hat it's not illegal doesn't mean Snowden did anything wrong by disclosing it.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#315

Maybe a naive question, but what would the risk be for me to sign this? I wonder if I (a US citizen) might get trouble the next time at the border? Or get a higher score in some database, that combined with other things might get me into trouble? Increased scrutiny from the IRS (which should have nothing to do with this, but "they" might say hell why not?)? Inability to get security clearances in future? Being target…

> A mode of thought I would expect in socialist countries, not the US...

It's ironic that given all the valid concerns in your post, you also fell for the oldest piece of propaganda in the book by the very government you're concerned about and that you think that socialism has something to do with dictatorships, rather than it being just an idea that itself has nothing to do with dictatorships in itself, but was in the past implemented by dictators, same as capitalism was in Latin America and elsewhere.

Nazi ideology is much more inherently tied to strongmen and dictatorships than socialist ideology is.

You also seem to be talking about communism, rather than socialism as such and fail to see the distinction between these two, or indeed between communism and Stalinism, but that's for a longer discussion...

Re: Pardon Snowden

#316

I'd like to sign the petition. I generally try not to think too much about implications of free opinion actions, to avoid these worries stop me from voicing my opinions. In these case also I'm not an US citizen so it is somewhat easier to do. But looks like only US citizens are allowd to sign this. Do you think that the signature of a non US citizen worths something?

Pfft, the form itself has mandatory fields, but doesn't seem to check the veracity of any of them... just put your name, put random content in any of the fields you're uncomfortable giving information for, choose California and 90210 as the ZIP and it'll let you submit.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#317
I am Canadian and I cannot sign this due to the address form being confined to US addresses.

Just putting this out there for any future endeavors of this kind.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#318

I think the problem is, people do not care anymore. The scandal is over, business as usual. Only a small percentage of the population still cares about Snowden. I think the image of the NSA has been hurt and a change in legislation might get you some positive press in the future, but I do not think that pardoning Snowden would be worth the effort for a politician. On the other hand: Obama probably does not have to ca…

And then there are people like me, who don't see the situation as black&white, i.e. I am not signing that petition. In my opinion, for the sake of security, it is necessary to "cache" the whole Internet communication to prevent terrorists attacks and other dangers. Like what the Brits are doing and currently they didn't have any big attack after the London bombings. I am not an American and I don't have a motivation…

If you are so sure that this sort of surveillance is effective due to the non happening if a rare event, then I have a tiger repelling rock to sell you. It is garunteed to stop tiger attacks.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#319

John Schindler's reporting works as a kind of explainer on why Obama/Clinton/Trump are v. unlikely to pardon him: https://20committee.com/2014/05/31/the-xx-committee-snowden-...

What a nut! That's certainly a kind of explainer on why it was better when the nation was run by the people's elected representatives rather than unaccountable unhinged spooks.

Re: Pardon Snowden

#320

Who are these guys? Registrar is in Panama. The site says "partnership with ACLU and Amnesty International", but I cannot find any links from those sites to pardonsnowden.org Both ACLU and AI have their own petition forms with different letters. https://www.amnesty.org/en/get-involved/take-action/edward-s... https://action.aclu.org/secure/grant_snowden_immunity Wondering if ACLU and AI are a little late to confirm, o…

> The American Civil Liberties Union and Amnesty International are ready to launch the "Pardon Snowden" campaign... pardonsnowden.org.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-37341804

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