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Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

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Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#301

Post by NoSalt »

Loughla wrote: post #190
UqWBcuFx6NV4r wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assure you that “old cars costing as much as new ones” isn’t the result of the market force of people reading contractual fine print and/or freaking out about telemetry. Concentric circles of echo chambers over here.

I agree. I have never met anyone in real life that's concerned about telemetry on their car. They're worried about the cost of a new car, and the cost of all the electronics, should they go bad.

I am completely concerned about it. I don't want my car talking to my insurance company or the government. The "dumber" the car, the better.

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#302

Post by JTbane »

freeopinion wrote: post #170
codazoda wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is tangential, but Kia declined to cover an engine failure, under warranty that was extended by recall, because I had not done an update. Edit: I eventually recovered most of the cost via a settlement court.

Even more tangential: Kia declined to cover an engine failure, under warranty that was extended by recall because I change my own oil. Kia's engines are known to fail predictably even within first 100K miles. They extended their warranty because of it. But then they weasel out of it unless you hire an attorney and go to war.

This makes me paranoid to buy a new car at this point. I would have to keep every single oil filter receipt and take a video of the DIY oil change.

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#304

Post by bri3d »

consp wrote: post #250
bri3d wrote: post #33

> limit or disable certain functionality in the vehicle: ... over-the-air updates, which provide new ... safety enhancements ... I wonder what happens if you disable the e-SIM (in the US) and then a safety recall appears via software update - do dealers have any way to update control modules besides OTA? This is a huge unresolved issue with EVs IMO; ICE cars are required to provide emissions-relevant updates over sof…

My experience is J2534 support is sketchy and if you want to do the things you actually want to do you need a manufacturer approved device with an insane markup. Also the subscriptions are insanely expensive, not even close to reasonable and you need to be a company (at least you used to be with Ford last time I checked, but they accept the UK or Dutch royal residence as a valid company location so there is that...)

I agree that J2534 is sketchy. The standard isn't very good to start with, there's usually no matrix (ie x systems * y devices) conformance testing but instead just a brief QA step done at some compliance stage in a release process, and most manufacturers don't really want to support it (preferring their in-house dongles). So, a lot of dealer tools do non-standard stuff and a "conforming" J2534 cable doesn't actually work.

Many subscriptions are painful, yes - VW brands / ODIS for example are awful to try to get as an individual and annoying as an independent shop; I'm sure the fraction of independent shops who pirate it are quite high. It's funny you mention Ford though, as they are incredibly easy to buy from in my experience, although the login/licensing backend is frequently broken.

However, there's a good cottage industry of companies reverse engineering the compatibility issues back out, and for better or worse these companies are cloned almost immediately too. I recently did key programming on a newer Ford (where Forscan can't) using a $125 VXDiag cable which I could have bought cloned for $30 and a short-term FDRS subscription that cost $50.

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#305

Post by bri3d »

doodlebugging wrote: post #296
consp wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience is J2534 support is sketchy and if you want to do the things you actually want to do you need a manufacturer approved device with an insane markup. Also the subscriptions are insanely expensive, not even close to reasonable and you need to be a company (at least you used to be with Ford last time I checked, but they accept the UK or Dutch royal residence as a valid company location so there is that...)

What about using ForSCAN? It allows anyone with the software and a dongle to monitor and to update modules in the ECU AFAIK. I paid under $100 (can't remember) for a dongle and downloaded the free software and it is extremely handy working on one of my vehicles. The other two Fords I own are both pre-OBDII so there is less bullshit on them to begin with. Ford forums are full of owners who use ForSCAN to modify their…

ForSCAN is awesome but it's an orthogonal conversation since it's a reverse engineered diagnostic tool rather than a first-party one. If we expand the conversation to that space there are tons of options with varying capabilities depending on manufacturer, including also pirating the OEM tools directly. Also worth noting that ForSCAN also doesn't _quite_ support all common operations, for example Remote Keyless Entry enrollment on newer BCMs with push-to-start needs FDRS still.

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#306

Post by bzzzt »

braiamp wrote: post #275
poochkoishi728 wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first link leads malicious ads/malware. On iphone says viruses detected pretending to be apple/google

I am on desktop and saw no such warning, but I'm also using adblockers and noscript.

It's a Wordpress site, probably hacked. Some Wordpress exploits only try to target 'high value' user agents like iPhones.

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#307

Post by throwway120385 »

chasing0entropy wrote: post #291
jjav wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Even on older cars, service techs can typically manually push firmware updates Older cars have no concept of such updates. Happy with my 70s and 80s and early 90s cars.

Actually almost any fuel injected vehicle can accept flash updates through the port to at least the ECU and PCM, frequently the BCU is also write enabled.

If there is a BCM. My previous 1995 GMC C1500 had a PCM and the automatic transmission was controlled by mechanical linkage to a hydraulic computer in the transmission along with shift solenoids from the PCM. It also had "throttle-body injection" with two injectors replacing the carburetor. The OBD 1 system would switch to "open loop control" with preprogrammed injection in the event of a malfunction which would make the thing challenging to drive until you fixed the problem. So very simple compared to the multitude of computers and control systems in use today.

A nice feature on that system was that you could put a paperclip between two pins on the diagnostic port and it would blink out the trouble codes on the SES light.

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#308

Post by culi »

Cider9986 wrote: post #36

Related: Mozilla did a review of different cars for privacy: ( https://www.mozillafoundation.org/en/privacynotincluded/arti... ) >Nissan earned its second-to-last spot for collecting some of the creepiest categories of data we have ever seen. [Their privacy policy] includes your “sexual activity.” Not to be out done, Kia also mentions they can collect information about your “sex life” in their privacy policy. Oh, and…

Makes it all the more shocking that Tesla placed last in the review. How do you even beat that?

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#309

Post by culi »

codedokode wrote: post #224

Internet-connected cars are a national security issue when manufacturers are from one country (A) and consumer is in another country (B). For example, the President of country A might wake up in a bad mood and order to disable all A-manufactured cars in B until they reconsider the trade deal. Or, he might order to collect geolocation, plugged for charging smartphone data, audio and video recordings from cars in B bel…

This has already happened. Mostly to Russia

> In late 2025, hundreds of Porsche vehicles in Russia became "bricked" (immobilized) because the cars’ satellite-based security systems (VTS) required continuous connectivity to European servers. Following the suspension of Porsche's operations in Russia, the cars could not "phone home" and automatically activated anti-theft immobilizers, preventing engines from starting.

> Tesla has remotely disabled Full Self-Driving (FSD) capabilities on vehicles in multiple countries—including Europe, South Korea, China, and Turkey—after detecting unauthorized "jailbreak" devices used to enable FSD in regions where it was not authorized.

> Reports from July 2024 indicate that Chinese brands have planned to or have blocked multimedia systems and other features in cars that were imported into Russia through non-authorized channels rather than through official dealers.

> American manufacturer John Deere remotely disabled advanced agricultural equipment looted by Russian forces from Ukraine, rendering the high-tech machinery useless after it was moved to Chechnya.

Re: Can I disable all data collection from my vehicle?

#310

Post by rtkwe »

Barbing wrote: post #243
porknubbins wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would be a violation of the Magnuson-Moss Warranty act of 1975 which requires they show the work done directly caused the failure. If this were a widespread policy I bet class action lawyers would be all over it without you having to pay for it.

Maybe they researched customers’ backgrounds and only screwed the ones they thought wouldn’t lawyer up

They broadly decline it for BS reasons betting that most people don't know it's illegal and/or won't try to force them to follow the law.
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