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Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

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Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#301

Post by Grisu_FTP »

YokoZar wrote: post #295
codebje wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steam and CodeWeavers contribute a lot of code to the Wine project, because it underpins their business models of supporting Windows games on non-Windows platforms. Between them they make up the vast bulk of what actually gets attention and improvement in Wine, and neither one has any interest in supporting non-game applications.

> neither one has any interest in supporting non-game applications. I don't know how much of their business it is today, but CodeWeavers spent their first decade or so supporting only non-game applications. Their product Crossover was originally Crossover Office because it was optimized around productivity applications.

Also a big part of the marketing for the SteamMachine/SteamDeck/SteamFrame is that it has a desktop mode and can be used like a pc, so i think they also have an interest in that

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#302

Post by consp »

duskwuff wrote: post #47
porphyra wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wine actually does run some ancient Windows games better than Windows 11 itself.

It certainly runs 16-bit Windows games better than Windows 11, which can't run them at all. Not that there are a ton of those, but it's still pretty neat that they work.

Time to dust off my cd copy of Stars! (From the disk backup, the cd had terminal illnesses and has died). The only win16 game I've ever seen distributed on CDROM. Wine already ran it ok (iirc there were some issues but nothing gamebraking), but now it can do so without i386 libs.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#303

Post by worthless-trash »

HWR_14 wrote: post #275
sdenton4 wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk, kernel anti cheat is a pretty clear sign to me that I should pick a different game to play anyway...

Does windows make it easy to tell the installer wants to install kernel anti cheat? It used to pop up the generic binary "This application wants to change files on your computer" which could be installing in the protected "Program Files" or could be modifying anything.

I dont think you can even load the "windows" kernel module in wine. Last time i tried with the capcom rootkit, it didnt work at all.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#304

Post by psyonity »

Dystakruul wrote: post #211
gpderetta wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More or less Wine + some experimental patches not yet I twgrated in mainstream wine + a buch of DirectX translation libraries + close steam integration.

There's also Proton-GE [1], which is even more experimental and adds some bleeding edge fixes and features. I've heard it's pretty good for fixing video playback/rendering (e.g. cutscene) issues if both the stable and the experimental branch of Proton can't make it work. [1] https://github.com/GloriousEggroll/proton-ge-custom

A lot of what Proton-GE brings from my understanding is a larger support for Media Foundation, which can't be added to Proton itself because of license issues (Proton is from a commercial company, where Proton-GE is from an individual).

So aside from the stuff that has been implemented differently, running Proton instead of Proton GE is like trying to game on Windows N editions.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#305

Post by gpderetta »

dwattttt wrote: post #276
gpderetta wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comes up often, but what can it do that poll can't?

Reading the link provided by https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47511778 , I believe "atomically acquire multiple objects". The link states they try to emulate it by performing a poll then a read, but the gap between those results in a race, which is a terrible thing to have in a synchronisation primitive. There was also something about needing to back out if any of the reads fails to acquire, which also sounds nas…

Great post.

Ah, interesting, so wfm does both the wait and the acquire!

When using eventfd it is indeed annoying having to both poll and later read to disarm the object (there are epoll tricks that can be used but are not generalizable).

The signal+wait is also a primitive that it is hard to implement atomically on posix.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#306

Post by ZiiS »

sdenton4 wrote: post #270
owaislone wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really is impressive. I wish publishers like EA and anti-cheat developers weren't so reluctant to support it. I hope Steam devices and SteamOS gain enough traction to force their hands.

Idk, kernel anti cheat is a pretty clear sign to me that I should pick a different game to play anyway...

Ironically the only way I would ever consider robust anti-cheet is if the game installed a seperate bootable Linux witch didn't have the encryption keys for my main partition.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#307

Post by Arwill »

cultofmetatron wrote: post #291
owaislone wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really is impressive. I wish publishers like EA and anti-cheat developers weren't so reluctant to support it. I hope Steam devices and SteamOS gain enough traction to force their hands.

Paying for a game that inserts rootkits into your kernel feels like paying money to get molested. no thanks.

Hate to be the one saying this, but that rootkit is there to prevent you from molesting/cheating other players. So its not an one-sided issue. It is unfortunate that the developers found no other way of fighting cheats, sure.

And by all means, if a game community is so toxic that it has to be policed by extreme measures, it is perhaps indeed better to avoid playing such a game altogether.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#308

Post by BatteryMountain »

ACS_Solver wrote: post #162
computomatic wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I avoided using Wine (and Linux for gaming generally) for years on the sole basis that I assumed what they were trying to do was impossible to do well. Occasionally I’d try wine for some simple game and be impressed it worked at all, but refused to admit to myself that it was something I could rely on. (This was many years ago and I freely admit today that I was wrong.)

Valve's Proton (so Wine + DXVK + some other additions) revolutionized gaming on Linux. I play games both for fun and work, and for a solid 3+ years now, gaming on Linux has been an "it just works" experience for me, and should be for most games that don't use kernel-level anticheat.

Now if only Steam would add a checkbox on their checkout page to add 10% donation/tip that goes directly to their upstream opensource dependencies (like the Wine team), that would be amazing! I would add extra money on every purchase to support these people!

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#309

Post by BatteryMountain »

Steam devs if you are reading this: add a checkbox on your checkout screen that will allow me to donate 10% or a flat amount with each purchase, that will go directly to your upstream opensource dependencies like Wine & friends. I would add money to each purchase without blinking to support these people and I think the correct place for this is at the steam checkout screen, in the case for gamers.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#310

Post by Prunkton »

so apparently it is Proton GE 10.9 from July'25 adding ntsync support [0].

I'm playing on wine now for several years now, my deepest respect for the developers involved. Thank you!

[0]: https://www.linuxcompatible.org/story/geproton109-released/

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