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We need to reclaim our attention

theguardian.com

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Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#301

Post by stevebmark »

One thing I believe to be true: If you have a device near you, there is no amount of habit or self control you can enact to change the habits of using that device. The same with the type of device. If a device has internet capabilities, no amount of self control or habit forming will make you only use the reading app on that device. You will always lose the habit at some point.

A requirement for changing habits is changing the physical world. Picking a device with no internet browsing capabilities, like an e-reader or a physical book. Or going for a walk where you physically don't have your phone. Even putting a phone in the next room isn't enough, you have to be somewhere where you physically can't access the phone.

Humans are not capable of fixing attention habits in which the physical world is set up to make it feasible to lose your attention.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#302

Post by LightHugger »

pier25 wrote: post #271
LightHugger wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very familiar to me, I've been trying to use some strategies to limit cognitive load to mixed success. The most effective thing has just been taking better notes. If i know i take good notes, and i write something down and know i will go back and read it, my brain knows it's "allowed" to forget about it, and that greatly lessons the load. Sounds obvious and simple but sometimes it's not obvious that spending…

You mean like documentation? Or what type of notes are you talking about?

Documentation would be a part of it but not really what im talking about. First step would be learning to recognize the thoughts that keep buzzing around in your head, like if are frequently noticing that you keep thinking "I gotta do X, which requires me to do Y, and this is how i should do Y but im not sure about Z and whether or not i do Z or Y first so now im thinking about how i should do Z".

Then those things need to get offloaded to some kind of note system. Just a text file can work, or a doc, or a paper notebook... It's good to write down the things you need to do, but also anything important about how you wanted to do them, or any inter-depencies you might forget about if you "offload" them now. Any thoughts you are 100% confident you can regenerate trivially dont get written down.

Once you have them stored, you need to mentally recognize that you no longer need to think about those things. It's kind of vague but thats the best i got. Then all the space it was taking up is free, and you're free to focus in on something more specific.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#303

Post by 300bps »

gnicholas wrote: post #230
redmaverickclon wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure. This is just a data point of 1. I used to browse Instagram casually. Like, once is a blue moon. I would see updates from my network and spend a few mins here and there. This was probably like over year or two back. (not 100% sure) And then a few months back I just could not take my eyes off of Instagram reels. This feature wasn't there before I think. I was just completely hooked. It was pretty interes…

I go on Facebook about once a month. I’ve noticed that Facebook’s friend recommendation engine now sprinkles in some beautiful women, with whom I have no friends in common. I don’t know if someone tuned the algorithm this way, or if it tuned itself. It feels like the desperate move of a platform that realizes it’s losing control of someone.

Did you see that movie about Facebook? According to that movie, what you described is literally what they do.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#304

Post by Zak »

sbolt wrote: post #300
Zak wrote: post #273

I want a digest system for notifications on my phone. This used to be common for mailing lists and web forums with email notification systems. I could get an email daily or weekly with the replies to my posts and subscriptions instead of real-time. The temptation to poll manually was reduced because I knew I'd be notified eventually. I want to be able to tell my phone to do the same with its notifications, preferably…

iOS 15 added something like what you are describing called Scheduled Summary. Notifications are snoozed and delivered at set times throughout the day (twice per day is the default). I believe there is also an API for developers of messaging apps to allow notification privilege escalation.

That is, indeed the feature I was describing. I hope iOS doing it means Android will follow suit soon.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#305

Post by woolion »

dgb23 wrote: post #288
woolion wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Technology does not respect biology. There is a mechanical view of man, that is similar to what hydroponics is to gardening. You look what are the required nutrients etc, and provide just that in a very sterile environment. Of course, the results are quite garbage. The fruits are tasteless, and the problems it brings (e.g. insect infestations) require a lot of pesticides. The technological vision is to solve these pr…

But all of those things increase the GDP, so they are automatically an improvement.

Someone posted "The bicycle is the slow death of the planet" not so long ago. It's not meant to be taken literally, but this is not very far from some people's line of thinking.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#306

Post by daemonhunter »

I feel my attention at work has gotten worse, the ability to focus has decreased. Sure, part of it is caused by my phone (gotta keep the music/background noise going oh and might as well glance at reddit) but ALOT of it is being a senior engineer.

It is my place to be asked questions throughout the day and I'd rather be asked questions than not. It takes me out of the zone and Sometimes it feels as though my mind is juggling 3+ tasks at once because of the questions I've been asked. I've learned through interaction with reality that some programmers need a bit more guidance when it comes to tasks, some will dig down the correct paths, some will dig down the incorrect paths, and some will just stop and wait for help (which is ok). I feel that at times I've done a poor job of guiding some people.

There have been days where I might actually start work on my individual tasks 5-6 hours into the day and staying late after everyone leaves is key to getting back in the zone and solving a problem.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#307

Post by estaseuropano »

andrewzah wrote: post #253
fullshark wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't necessarily mean a problem as a matter of taste, more a destruction of shared cultural values, in particular those that are good for "society" like a belief in the value of work, family unit, deeper concerns than material wealth (e.g. god/spirituality) etc at least in the west / America.

I will never understand how people can suggest a specific musical genre or a medium is responsible for ruining society or "destroying values like the value of work" with a straight face. When I ask for empirical proof of such things, there never is any, just anecdotal statements. As if country music never touched upon these sorts of topics. Or books. Or ... Moral panics come from old people who don't like anything th…

Moral panics also come from normal people who have felt the effect on their and their families' lives. For instance I am neither a prude nor a tea-totaler but I can see how many hours or my own life porn and alcohol have taken, hours that I sure enjoyed but that would have been better and as pleasantly invested in other activities. I know people that have sunk into porn addictions and lost their lives, including any ability to enjoy normal sex. And we all know what an alcoholic looks like. So is the ubiquitous availability of porn a good thing or a bad thing or something with nuance?

If you had a loved one disappear in world of Warcraft or a porn spiral you will start to question whether those are normal things that should remain so openly available without limits.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#308

Post by Apocryphon »

thegrimmest wrote: post #295
Apocryphon wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What ensures the parties involved are free? Many of these issues being discussed deal with consequences experienced by one party that were never disclosed by the other. Information asymmetry makes such contracts un-free and thus the legal framework should permit nullification and redress.

> What ensures the parties involved are free? The prohibition by the government of the physical force requisite to deprive people of their freedom. > the legal framework should permit nullification and redress It does already. Contracts have disclosure clauses all the time.

Contracts have disclosure clauses all the time.

To bring it back to the article at hand, did social media and other tech companies disclose the negative effects of the use of their products in their EULA?

The prohibition by the government of the use of physical force requisite to deprive people of their freedom.

If a distributor of an addiction-forming substance engenders an addiction in customers, is that not utilizing physical force to deprive them of their freedom? Especially if the addictive properties were not disclosed ahead of time.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#309

Post by estaseuropano »

watwut wrote: post #137
zippystrider wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ease of access of today's distractions leads me to disagree. It's so easy to take out your phone to check a social media app, or open a tab on your laptop to a social media website like Reddit, versus turning on a radio or getting up to turn on the TV. A comic book doesn't fit in your front pocket, but a phone does; there's just so much less friction for distraction today.

And still, very few people read social media till they sleep deprived themselves. Very few people end up yelling at everyone around when something does not work out in game. Both of these are fairly common for gamers, but computer games are always defended here. So yeah, it is pure moral panic, except about something average HN commenter does not think he do.

Tiktok is the most accessed web resource in 2022, with only a small number of people using it. Worst of all, it is the teenagers that lose their lives there. A grandma playing candy crush - sad but not a societal problem. Teenagers that miss out on school, or young moms that don't anymore look at their kids, or young workers that can't focus - enormous societal problem.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#310

Post by [deleted] »

batch12 wrote: post #55
slibhb wrote: post #42

> Some scientists say these worries about attention are a moral panic, comparable to the anxieties in the past about comic books or rap music, and that the evidence is shaky. I agree with them. It's hard to pay attention to something for long unless it's entertaining. Reading a book, reading a paper, etc -- these activities take discipline that most people don't develop or don't often apply. This isn't new. The mista…

Respectfully, these examples- radio and TV aren't even in the same league as the manipulation and engagement that comes from the algorithmic feedback loop that backs these services. The comparison is dangerously dismissive.

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